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Splitting threads

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halplm
Post subject: Splitting threads
Posted: Wed 30 Nov , 2005 7:39 pm
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I dont' like it. I've said I don't like it, and I think it causes more trouble than it fixes.

There's an inherant dislike of starting new threads for several reasons. First of all, if everyone is reading one or two threads, you want to make your comments in those threads, so everyone who's paying attention reads them. Secondly, if you start creating a new thread every time you have a new thought, we have tons of two or three post threads, which clutters things up.

On the other hand, for a thread meant for a specific purpose, we want to keep that post on topic, so the concept of splitting occurs. There are several reasons I think this is bad.

1. The flow of the thread is interrupted. Threads wander naturally. It is not intentionally that they go off topic. In fact, most people post in response to something thinking it is entirely ON topic.

2. Usually, the splitting takes place by somone not following the thread. True, it's requested by someone in the thread, but if the person coming in to do the splitting doesn't really know what's going on, how are they to know where the split should occur?

3. It feels like a punishment. You can't keep on topic, so we're moving your posts elsewhere, good luck getting anyoen to read them. If the issue is bigger than the one topic in the one thread, and thigns are constantly split off, lots of stuff is lost, and people just never see it.

4. It's not a whole lot better than deletion. Who's going to go read a thread that was split off of the main one? I know it would never occur to me to...

I know it's difficult to keep up with all the stuff going on around the main thread, but is it really better to ignore all the rest, just so you don't have to read through other people's thoughts on closely related subjects? Would it not be better to understand the whole of a situation than just one narrow point of view?

I don't have a better suggestion. I kind of wish we could undo all the splits as I think the last two weeks are impossible to piece together any more, and there is much confusion about who said what where, and what took place where and why. I think it's added to the problem a HUGE amount.

In the latest split, it makes no sense to split off the few posts that were responding to thigns going on in the thread, and calling them off topic, when the conversation had been off topic for a couple of pages, leading to those few posts. I have fealt this way every time my posts have been split off, even when they were very much off topic.

We need a better solution.


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Axordil
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Posted: Wed 30 Nov , 2005 8:02 pm
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The better solution, hal, would be for people to not force the split in the first place.

And maybe I'm a Chinese fighter pilot.

There are threads where it's OK for things to flow organically, and threads where it's really, really important to keep things focused. The committee thread is in the latter class, which I do feel is smaller than the first...but not nonexistant.

BTW: thanks for starting this as a new thread. :)

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Eruname
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Posted: Wed 30 Nov , 2005 8:04 pm
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Quote:
We need a better solution.
Stay on topic.


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halplm
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Posted: Wed 30 Nov , 2005 8:10 pm
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sorry, we need a better solution when things go OFF topic.

but again, it's not that their OFF topic, it's that their only "close" to the topic.

It's hart to be really off topic when your responding in a thread. But people take different lines of thought to respond to, and you get off topic. That's why it's hard to know where to split something. Eventually it all goes back to ON topic.


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Axordil
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Posted: Wed 30 Nov , 2005 8:21 pm
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Some message board systems have options than enable threading, which would solve the problem This isn't one of them, unfortunately. Better to move than to delete or edit, in my opinion.

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Lidless
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Posted: Wed 30 Nov , 2005 8:44 pm
Als u het leven te ernstig neemt, mist u de betekenis.
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I just hope a thread isn't whilst I'm in the mi

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Anthriel
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Posted: Wed 30 Nov , 2005 9:00 pm
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:LMAO:

Lidless, that's the first time I've laughed about something on b77 for a while.

Thank y


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halplm
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Posted: Wed 30 Nov , 2005 9:03 pm
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yes, move is better than delete or edit, but even better still, would be to let those topics finish themselves, and move back to the original topic.

This is especially true of threads that are not as specific as the charter thread, such as back when everythign was split and that thread was created.

The only reason off-topic discussions keep happening in that thread, is that no one has any idea WHICH other thread should be used. There's like, 15 of them now! That's the only active thread on the whole mess any more. That should be recognized, and people should be able to deal with it.

It once again becomes an issue of... which is more important, the posters with something they think is important to say and have read, or the sanctity of this committee thread?


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Axordil
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Posted: Wed 30 Nov , 2005 9:13 pm
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That's a false dichotomy. There was a perfectly good thread for discussion in the symposium, one in which most if not all of the familiar names appear. I don't know why it dropped off, but it seemed to serve the purpose. Here, I'll even bump it.

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Jnyusa
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Posted: Wed 30 Nov , 2005 9:15 pm
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It was spammed to death.

Jn

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Axordil
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Posted: Wed 30 Nov , 2005 9:16 pm
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Better it than the committee thread. :D

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Jnyusa
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Posted: Wed 30 Nov , 2005 9:17 pm
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True.

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Eruname
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Posted: Wed 30 Nov , 2005 9:19 pm
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Jnyusa wrote:
It was spammed to death.
Heaven forbid people actually getting along and having a good time. Given the atmosphere of that thread and many others, one would think seeing people interacting with kindness would be a good thing.


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halplm
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Posted: Wed 30 Nov , 2005 9:21 pm
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no, it is not a false dichotomy. It is once again the fluidity of message boards that must be taken into account.

If Cerin (for example) says something in the committee thread that I feel the need to respond to, even if it's not 100% on topic, I need to respond to it THERE. I can't go respond to it in a totally unrelated thread where She may or may not see it. If things are to make sense, the response must be there.

OR we can spawn a hundred different threads to discuss every issue that is not 100% on topic with the committee, some of which may get read, most of which would not.


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Axordil
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Posted: Wed 30 Nov , 2005 9:21 pm
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Hey, when Lidless notes that a thread has been spammified, it means it was well and truly spammified. ;)

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Anthriel
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Posted: Wed 30 Nov , 2005 9:35 pm
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Erunáme wrote:
Jnyusa wrote:
It was spammed to death.
Heaven forbid people actually getting along and having a good time. Given the atmosphere of that thread and many others, one would think seeing people interacting with kindness would be a good thing.
Well, I was involved in a thread where it was split BECAUSE it had spontaneous hugging going on in it. The hugging was objected to as spam.

I felt, at the time, that the hugging was "people interacting with kindness", and I thought it was a good thing. Not everyone saw it the same way, I guess.


One man's spam is another man's main meal for the day.


Or something.


:help:


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halplm
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Posted: Wed 30 Nov , 2005 9:38 pm
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there have been a lot of requests for splits out of frustration I think... that normally wouldn't have been requested, but were because of all the other splits going on...

This is one of the reasons I think it has become a problem.

Even if splitting is better than editing or deleting, it should be a rare thing, not something done on the whim of a poster or ranger.

It seems like people have latched onto it and said... Oh, I can do this without making a fuss about it, so I will...


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Axordil
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Posted: Wed 30 Nov , 2005 9:52 pm
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Quote:
it should be a rare thing, not something done on the whim of a poster or ranger.
Agreed. It should show up in less than 1% of threads. Which it does. :D

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halplm
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Posted: Wed 30 Nov , 2005 9:52 pm
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You're joking, but I'm serious.


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Axordil
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Posted: Wed 30 Nov , 2005 9:54 pm
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Actually, I'm smiling, but serious too. I would guess that far less than 1% of threads are affected. But the ones that are affected are disproportionately high-traffic threads with controversial topics, so they stand out.

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