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 Post subject: Current situation
PostPosted: Sat 24 Jan , 2009 7:44 pm 
Insolent Pup
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I understand why action has been taken against two posters. I understand that the rules of the board limit the mods. I understand that hal and sf constantly poke and prod. With that being said, I disagree with the action taken because of the way the rules are set up. What should the mods have done? Can't say, don't know. As a member of this board, I can disagree with the action even while agreeing with the problem. The board seems to want to be more like a standard message board, yet the language of the rules still says democratic message board. I came here for the democratic message board, and maybe it has failed, especially if the push is for more moderator power. Truthfully, the rules should be changed to reflect this without all of this committee stuff (don't get me wrong, I think that the members and jnyusa are doing a fine job). I don't care for to the direction of the board anymore. No reason to change it to please one person, though. I wouldn't even ask that, but I am removing myself from the board for the time being. Please remove me from the committee, and you can (you don't have to) remove me from ranger, jury, etc. pool.

Good luck in the future, b77.

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 Post subject: Re: Current situation
PostPosted: Sat 24 Jan , 2009 7:48 pm 
The Grey Amaretto as Supermega-awesome Proud Heretic Girl
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I'm sorry to hear that TED, and I'd like to hope that you'll change your mind. I think we're doing our best to re-figure out who we are and where we want to be and go; it would be nice for you to be a part of that. Maybe we'll arrive at the conclusion that we don't want to change anything. Maybe the changes will come, but they'll be positive.

I guess I'm saying that I think leaving now is premature. :shrug:

But good luck to you and peace and all of that cool stuff.


Lali

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 Post subject: Re: Current situation
PostPosted: Sat 24 Jan , 2009 7:56 pm 
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Sorry to hear that. I can't I understand this position at all. What good are "the rules" if the board is miserable? We're just a messageboard of friends, not the UN. :shrug:
But if that's how feel, ah well. I hope you come back soon.


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 Post subject: Re: Current situation
PostPosted: Sat 24 Jan , 2009 8:28 pm 
bioalchemist
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Oh bloody fucking hell.

TED, you posted a goddammed POLL so people could vote to have hal banned. That's against the rules on multiple levels so tell me, if you're so upset at the far gentler and temporary actions the Rangers actually took while the board was lying down in agony, how would you be feeling if we'd let your idea go through?

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 Post subject: Re: Current situation
PostPosted: Sat 24 Jan , 2009 8:33 pm 
Same as it ever was

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I can see where TED s coming from, I do not like getting blanket pms from someone that I am not even close to, and I have also thought lately of leaving the board.

My problem is maybe board related, when I got the unwanted pm, I had no options even to respond to it.

In the meantime, I turned off all pm notifications, and I will be here rarely. I am sick to death of one or two people crapping out and making my enjoyment of the board suffer.

We need stronger powers here, which includes banning.

:rage:

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 Post subject: Re: Current situation
PostPosted: Sat 24 Jan , 2009 8:37 pm 
bioalchemist
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Watcher, hal's mass PM won't be happening again. I shut that off after the first one went out. I probably should have anticipated that action on his part, but I didn't. None of us did. I am dreadfully sorry.

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 Post subject: Re: Current situation
PostPosted: Sat 24 Jan , 2009 8:38 pm 
A song outlasts a dynasty.
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:( This is shit. The PM was just part of a little hissy fit. The problem is that these hissy fits keep happening, and every time they happen, more people get driven away. It starting to look like the options are either leave Hal here and lose everyone else or ban him and lose... well... just him. It's not difficult to tell which is the lesser of the two evils. :(

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 Post subject: Re: Current situation
PostPosted: Sat 24 Jan , 2009 8:39 pm 
The Grey Amaretto as Supermega-awesome Proud Heretic Girl
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Well, but that's not TED's point, Watcher. :scratch: His point is that, while he acknowledges the problem of hal, he doesn't like Rangers having the power to stop him (or people acting like he's acting). TED can correct me if I've misunderstood him.

IOW, he doesn't like the way hal is behaving, but he doesn't think the Rangers should have the power to make him stop. Or, maybe it's that he doesn't like the way these Rangers chose to make hal stop.

Yeah, we were all annoyed by hal's PM. It was a fear when we made PMing the entire board an option (that someone would abuse it). Of course, now that I think about it, hal said he didn't PM the whole board, just the list of members who post the most frequently. So nevermind.

Anyway, I don't like a few people holding this board hostage either with their continual crap-fests, but I'm willing to stay and work to make it stop.

(Gosh, this reminds me of church. :bang: )


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 Post subject: Re: Current situation
PostPosted: Sat 24 Jan , 2009 8:56 pm 
Filthy darwinian hobbit
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Sorry TED feels that way for this is as democratic a board as you'll come across. The difficulties went on far too long while people tried to do the right thing. In the end the rangers have power that is limited but real. They must be allowed to use it when necessary otherwise it is pointless devolving that power on to them. Moreover the Rangers change regularly so a situation is not set in stone as on other boards.

TED is a cool voice of reason and debate that I'd be loth to lose so I hope he does stick his head back in.

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 Post subject: Re: Current situation
PostPosted: Sat 24 Jan , 2009 9:15 pm 
Just keep singin'!
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People come and go from boards all the time. They move on, for various reasons. People also get banned - some boards ban at the drop of a hat, and some are more circumspect.

People on this board have been bending over backwards to accommodate Hal for a long time now. I'm sorry, but it's time for Hal to move on. And if he won't go on his own, it's time for the board to give him a push.

I have great respect for the Rangers and great contempt for Hal's continual trashing of them. I notice he has never volunteered to be a Ranger himself. His constant insults, his spamming the board with the same opinions repeated over and over, his one-line sarcastic drive-by posts, his refusal to examine his own posting style...and his painting himself as the victim - all these things have added up and made Hal as undesirable a poster as a board could have.

If TED leaves, he leaves. People leave messageboards. I totally support the action of the Rangers and feel it should have been taken long ago.


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 Post subject: Re: Current situation
PostPosted: Sat 24 Jan , 2009 9:47 pm 
Same as it ever was

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Location: Cake or DEATH? Errr, cake please...
Lali, while I see where TED was going for sort of an objective view of problem posters, I will admit, I no longer can take that view. I also do not want to be contacted by posters that I am not in agreement with and then have no means to respond to their obnoxious posts.

Maybe HoF had the correct idea all along.

:neutral:

In any case, I do not want to be contacted by hal again. Ever.

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Never under any circumstances take a sleeping pill and a laxative on the same night.

- Dave Barry


Glaciers melting in the dead of night and the superstars sucked into the supermassive...
Supermassive Black Hole.

- Muse


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 Post subject: Re: Current situation
PostPosted: Sat 24 Jan , 2009 10:10 pm 
bioalchemist
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Watcher, we're working on this from our end. He can't PM anyone right now and who knows what penalties the jury will impose. You also have the power to disable your own ability to receive PMs. Rangers will still be able to contact you via PM; no one else will.

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 Post subject: Re: Current situation
PostPosted: Sat 24 Jan , 2009 10:13 pm 
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Don't go TED.

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Last edited by Cenedril_Gildinaur on Tue Feb 30, 2026 13:61 am; edited 426 times in total


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 Post subject: Re: Current situation
PostPosted: Sat 24 Jan , 2009 10:22 pm 
Aspiring to heresy
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TED, I don't understand your reasoning, and I confess I have little sympathy for it. You say you don't know what the mods should have done. Well, should they have done nothing? We've done nothing for years, and it didn't work. This board is just a shadow of what it once was. Scores of people have left, and I suspect if I had a chance to ask them, they would say "because of halplm". Quite frankly, we should have dealt decisively with the problem three years ago. Maybe it's too late now.

Do you object to suspending his PM privileges? Would it be okay to let him continually spam everyone's inboxes? Or, should the rangers have sent another mass PM to set the record straight on the lies he told, and then have a back-and-forth war in people's inboxes with each party repeatedly telling their side of the story? Would that be better?

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 Post subject: Re: Current situation
PostPosted: Sat 24 Jan , 2009 11:21 pm 
Islanded in a Stream of Stars
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jewelsong wrote:
I have great respect for the Rangers and great contempt for Hal's continual trashing of them. I notice he has never volunteered to be a Ranger himself.


You're incorrect. hal has served as a ranger once. From 03 Feb to 30 April 06. This information can be found in this post:

viewtopic.php?p=89288#p89288

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 Post subject: Re: Current situation
PostPosted: Sat 24 Jan , 2009 11:28 pm 
Just keep singin'!
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I stand corrected.


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 Post subject: Re: Current situation
PostPosted: Sun 25 Jan , 2009 12:08 am 
Try to stay perky
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I'm very sad about TED's decision. :( I hope that a breather away from the board may be enough to tempt you back, TED.

I observe in passing that halplm is the most powerful member of this board. That is not a good thing.

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 Post subject: Re: Current situation
PostPosted: Sun 25 Jan , 2009 12:21 am 
Let the dice fly.
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I understand TED's pov in that it does make me uncomfortable that members should be restricted/banned without input from the greater community of posters and with no backup from the rules. On the other hand, I'm as sick of hal as anyone and having been a Ranger recently, understand how much that job utterly blows.

The problem is that the Charter should never have gone into effect without a provision for (fairly) easily banning problem members. Of course, due to the emotional climate when the Charter was created, that's the one thing nobody wanted to have included, etc etc.

The point is, we have all held to those rules before now out of sheer good will and respect for one another. If the current Rangers have been driven beyond those rules, if the vast majority of the current posting popular seems pleased that they did, it strikes me that it can only be because the restricted posters in question have lost the good will and respect of these people. And if that is the case, why the hell would they even want to post here anymore?

What would I do if I could do whatever I pleased? Have a hearing for banning hal...he states his case in one post, Rangers state theirs, each party gets a one post rebbutal, voting is open for a set period of time, as many members who want to vote on whether there should be a ban or not. It's not what the Charter prescribes exactly, but it's close enough in spirit imo, and it gets the problem over with.

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 Post subject: Re: Current situation
PostPosted: Sun 25 Jan , 2009 12:24 am 
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Elian wrote:
What would I do if I could do whatever I pleased? Have a hearing for banning hal...he states his case in one post, Rangers state theirs, each party gets a one post rebbutal, voting is open for a set period of time, as many members who want to vote on whether there should be a ban or not. It's not what the Charter prescribes exactly, but it's close enough in spirit imo, and it gets the problem over with.

Well, we're trying to have a hearing anyway. :) We'll see how it goes.

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 Post subject: Re: Current situation
PostPosted: Sun 25 Jan , 2009 12:27 am 
Let the dice fly.
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Rebecca wrote:
Well, we're trying to have a hearing anyway. :) We'll see how it goes.



Yeah, I saw that...I was just skipping the whole Jury step, basically. ;) I've always been very efficient. :LMAO:

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