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Split from Campaign 2008:War On Terror and the candidates

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Cenedril_Gildinaur
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Posted: Wed 13 Feb , 2008 6:44 am
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halplm wrote:
TP, I was more responding to vison, certainly.
Cenedril_Gildinaur wrote:
halplm wrote:
we are bringing stability to it, more and more every day.

Someday, people are going to have to wake up and realize that we won in Iraq.
When you start from absolutely nothing, any improvement is massive improvement. The invasion reduced Iraqi structure to nothing. The question is have we improved things to the level that they were before things were reduced to nothing?

Yes, things may be constantly improving ... have we broken even yet?

And, are they really improving, or are things breaking as fast as they are being repaired?

Anyway, define "victory" in Iraq.
Victory is what we have and are accomplishing. The only thing that is not victory, is packing up and abandoning the people we have managed to help.
Define it then. If "victory" is "never leaving", that's a pretty sallow definition of victory. What specific actions or accomplishments would be victory. You don't "have and are accomplishing". You either are there, or you are moving towards it or away from it.

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It is a myth that coercion is necessary in order to force people to get along together, but it is a persistent myth because it feeds a desire many people have. That desire is to be able to justify hurting people who have done nothing other than offend them in some way.

Last edited by Cenedril_Gildinaur on Tue Feb 30, 2026 13:61 am; edited 426 times in total


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halplm
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Posted: Wed 13 Feb , 2008 9:21 am
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how about you define victory? I define victory as anything but defeat.

what do you propose we do, that is within your ideals of how to be "perfect" as the grand country we are... that is NOT defeat?

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Pippin4242
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Posted: Wed 13 Feb , 2008 1:10 pm
Hasta la victoria, siempre
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Victory is when you achieve the goal for which the war was begun.

Could be a problem in Iraq.

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Cenedril_Gildinaur
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Posted: Wed 13 Feb , 2008 3:37 pm
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Well, since we invaded to get rid of WMDs, and there were no WMDs in the first place, then we achieved victory before we went in.

If we invaded to remove Saddam, then we had victory back when he was hanged and can go home now.

If we invaded to fight Al Qeada, there were no Al Qaeda before we invaded and there are some now, so we were defeated.

If we invaded to create a secular liberal democracy ... good luck.

Halplm, if you define victory as anything except defeat, then define defeat.

Last edited by Cenedril_Gildinaur on Wed 13 Feb , 2008 4:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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It is a myth that coercion is necessary in order to force people to get along together, but it is a persistent myth because it feeds a desire many people have. That desire is to be able to justify hurting people who have done nothing other than offend them in some way.

Last edited by Cenedril_Gildinaur on Tue Feb 30, 2026 13:61 am; edited 426 times in total


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LalaithUrwen
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Posted: Wed 13 Feb , 2008 3:39 pm
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Hanged. The proper term is "hanged," not hung, since we're being so nit-picky now about spelling and the like.

Carry on.


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Ara-anna
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Posted: Wed 13 Feb , 2008 3:47 pm
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Yeah Chuck Norris is hung.

Everyone else is hanged.

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Lidless
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Posted: Wed 13 Feb , 2008 4:02 pm
Als u het leven te ernstig neemt, mist u de betekenis.
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:damnfunny:

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LalaithUrwen
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Posted: Wed 13 Feb , 2008 4:25 pm
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:D That also made me laugh.


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Iavas_Saar
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Posted: Wed 13 Feb , 2008 5:11 pm
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LalaithUrwen wrote:
Hanged. The proper term is "hanged," not hung, since we're being so nit-picky now about spelling and the like.
We are?

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vison
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Posted: Wed 13 Feb , 2008 5:12 pm
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I don't know, it isn't just Chuck Norris . . . :D

It seems that pedantic sorts use "hanged" when talking about stretching the neck of a bad guy, and use "hung" if they keep the rope nailed to their wall as a souvenir.

Like "dove" for "dived". It's just a matter of nitpickery vs slobbism.

I fall between 2 stools. :D

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Ara-anna
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Posted: Wed 13 Feb , 2008 5:26 pm
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Well the article did say hanged was for people and hung was for meat. So yes Chuck Norris is hung. :cool:





Where's *E* when I need her. :scratch:

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yovargas
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Posted: Wed 13 Feb , 2008 5:48 pm
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I'd just like to point out that my illness metaphor was not only clever, but very wise and insightful and that it should therefore be acknowledged and admired as such.

:P


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Iavas_Saar
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Posted: Wed 13 Feb , 2008 5:50 pm
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yovargas wrote:
I'd just like to point out that my illness metaphor was not only clever, but very wise and insightful and that it should therefore be acknowledged and admired as such.
It left me speechless which is why I didn't say anything.

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vison
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Posted: Wed 13 Feb , 2008 6:27 pm
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Well, I DID say something, but I was speechless just the same.

:D

It was a pretty good metaphor, but not applicable.

One's metaphors must be applicable to be truly great. :cool:

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Ara-anna
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Posted: Wed 13 Feb , 2008 6:37 pm
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Chuch Norris metaphors are truly great.







ducks away from the rotten veggies boos and runs out

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Cenedril_Gildinaur
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Posted: Wed 13 Feb , 2008 7:08 pm
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Let us thread split out the entire hanged-hung-Norris discussion.

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It is a myth that coercion is necessary in order to force people to get along together, but it is a persistent myth because it feeds a desire many people have. That desire is to be able to justify hurting people who have done nothing other than offend them in some way.

Last edited by Cenedril_Gildinaur on Tue Feb 30, 2026 13:61 am; edited 426 times in total


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Lidless
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Posted: Wed 13 Feb , 2008 8:20 pm
Als u het leven te ernstig neemt, mist u de betekenis.
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*snip*

Last edited by Lidless on Sat 16 Feb , 2008 7:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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The Watcher
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Posted: Wed 13 Feb , 2008 8:20 pm
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Uh, just where do people want it to go?

:Q

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LalaithUrwen
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Posted: Wed 13 Feb , 2008 8:21 pm
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We could, but what is there to discuss? It's a given fact, one of the established laws of the universe.

Chuck Norris is hung.

:scratch: Can there be any doubt?


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MariaHobbit
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Posted: Wed 13 Feb , 2008 8:26 pm
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Well nothing is certain, but he seems to be able to grow facial hair, so he's probably not a eunuch.

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