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PostPosted: Tue 15 Apr , 2008 3:17 pm 
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http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080415/ap_ ... e_anorexia

On the one hand, I don't like the idea of censorship at all.

On the other hand, the picture of the woman in that article makes me think a bit - if pictures like that were banned, models wouldn't be under such pressure to be so thin and would, in fact, be under pressure to be healthy. Not a bad thing....

I don't like the idea of a nanny state even more than I don't like the fashion industries current idea of beauty.

Tricky - so I thought I would ask your opinions on this

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Last edited by Estel on Wed 16 Apr , 2008 11:47 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue 15 Apr , 2008 4:12 pm 
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So if you happen to be thin you can't model?
While I appreciate their effort, this opens up more cans of worms than you can shake a stick figure at.


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PostPosted: Tue 15 Apr , 2008 4:18 pm 
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They'd just pick some other difficult-to-attain physical trait to make into the new rage. You can't sell beauty if everyone's already beautiful.


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PostPosted: Tue 15 Apr , 2008 5:14 pm 
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Hm. I'm all for some restrictions on this, but I'm not sure if this law is the best way to do it. "Publicly incite extreme thinness" - that seems both very broad and very vague. I thought it was a good idea when those fashion shows decided to have a lower BMI limit: no models that are ranked by the UN as underweight. (Yes, I know there are controversies regarding using BMI.) I don't have some splendid idea regarding what the French lawmakers should have done, I think there is something not quite right about the wording of that law - but I'm all for doing something. The fashion industry is not going to change by itself. But in my opinion, it should definitely change.

Holbytla wrote:
So if you happen to be thin you can't model?


But as it is now, in practice, you can't be a model if you're not thin...

---

Sorry if I stray off topic now, but Estel's mention of a "nanny state" made me lift an eyebrow. This whole thread somehow reminded me of the Norwegian advertising laws:

Quote:
Advertising restrictions
· Advertising for tobacco products is illegal.
· Advertising for alcohol is also illegal.
· TV commercials directed towards children, i.e. toy commercials, are illegal.
· TV commercials for political parties are not allowed.
· TV stations from within Norway can NOT interrupt shows to show commercial breaks, but interrupting movies to show another program, such as the news, is allowed (and it is legal to show commercials before and after the interrupting program).


My point here is mostly about the first two things, tobacco and alcohol, which also can be partly compared to this French law. Do I feel that I'm living in a nanny state? No. I feel I'm living in a state that is taking responsibility for its citizens. (And, if one prefers to think in terms of money, for the state economy in a very well-developed welfare state...)

(And believe me, the American presidential campaign makes me want to kiss whoever made that political party TV commercial law. :roll::blackeye:)

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PostPosted: Tue 15 Apr , 2008 6:10 pm 
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The woman in that pic looks dead...

And I think the sentiment is not "If you're thin you can't be a model", but rather "If you're dangerously and disgustingly thin you can't be a model"

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PostPosted: Tue 15 Apr , 2008 7:04 pm 
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I agree there is a large problem, but I don't think the way of fixing it is to create other problems. Especially with that open ended vague language.

Don't even get me started on Nanny States. :rage:


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PostPosted: Tue 15 Apr , 2008 7:48 pm 
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I feel like I live in one sometimes

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PostPosted: Tue 15 Apr , 2008 7:51 pm 
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What has your state done to you? ^^

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PostPosted: Tue 15 Apr , 2008 8:06 pm 
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Nienor SharkAttack wrote:
Advertising restrictions
· Advertising for tobacco products is illegal.
· Advertising for alcohol is also illegal.
· TV commercials directed towards children, i.e. toy commercials, are illegal.
· TV commercials for political parties are not allowed.
· TV stations from within Norway can NOT interrupt shows to show commercial breaks, but interrupting movies to show another program, such as the news, is allowed (and it is legal to show commercials before and after the interrupting program).


:Q :Q :Q

That does it; I'm moving to Norway. I have a Viking name now, so I figure I'm all set.


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PostPosted: Tue 15 Apr , 2008 8:37 pm 
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Nienor SharkAttack wrote:
What has your state done to you? ^^


It's just a comparison thing between living in the US and living in the UK - the UK can, at times, surprise me. For instance, laws against "inciting racial hatred" when I come from a country where the KKK is still allowed to hold rallies (and four times as many people show up across the street for a counter rally ;) ). I'm not saying that something like inciting racial hatred should be allowed - that was just the first example that popped into my head. It's just weird to come from a country where freedom of speech is held so sacred that even assshats can have their say (and everyone can make fun of them for it), to a country where if you tell a particularily bad joke, it is possible that someone in authority might say that you've crossed the line and you could be arrested.

But, back to the topic here - I don't think an actual law like this would pass in the U.S. Guidelines enforced by the fashion community itself, perhaps, but not a law. I think if one did pass, it would be struck down as unconstitutional by the Supreme Court before you could blink twice.

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PostPosted: Tue 15 Apr , 2008 10:04 pm 
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There are many things I am not proud about the US for, but it does make me feel some pride for my country that it does allow public KKK rallies. You rock, America.


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PostPosted: Tue 15 Apr , 2008 10:06 pm 
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Oh hush :P - I said it was an example that I could think of off the top of my head. I never said it was a good example.

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PostPosted: Tue 15 Apr , 2008 10:18 pm 
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:scratch: I was 100% serious!!!


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PostPosted: Tue 15 Apr , 2008 10:24 pm 
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:Q Really? :blackeye:

A little bit more specific on the bill that France is considering:

Quote:
The bill would make it illegal to "provoke a person to seek excessive weight loss by encouraging prolonged nutritional deprivation that would have the effect of exposing them to risk of death or directly compromise health."

It calls for prison terms of up to two years and fines of up to $47,000 for offenders, with punishment increasing to three years in prison and a $71,000 fine in cases where a victim dies of an eating disorder


It's also targeting pro-anorexia type websites even more so than the fashion industry.

Basically the same article as in the first post, but with some added information:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080415/ap_ ... z_y1hvaA8F

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PostPosted: Tue 15 Apr , 2008 10:51 pm 
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Estel wrote:
:Q Really? :blackeye:


Totally. It's a great symbol to me of how much we care about freedom of speech.
I bet you can now guess what I think of that French law. :)


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PostPosted: Tue 15 Apr , 2008 11:19 pm 
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Probably the same thing as I do ;)


Although, I do think pro-anorexia sites should be watched and regulated, and at least made 18 or older only. I mean, even the U.S. doesn't allow pro-suicide websites that explain how to go about it, do they? Cause that's basically all a pro-anorexia website is - an explanation of how to commit suicide slowly.

I don't know about making it against the law, but..... people who start a website in order to encourage other people on what is essentially how to die should have to take some modicum of responsibility for their actions, even if it's just the ability to bring a civil case against them for medical or funeral expenses or something.

It's a tricky issue. On the one hand, there is freedom of speech and expression, on the other hand, the ability to hold accountable those who actively go out and encourage a death seeking behaviour.

And no, I don't think that it can be compared to extreme sports - those are done for fun and are not an actual illness. - Just a random disclaimer to an arguement I could totally see coming up ;)

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PostPosted: Wed 16 Apr , 2008 1:22 am 
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Just for the sake of discussion, how do you define "encourage a death seeking behaviour"? Do alcohol, cigarettes and greasy food fall into the same category?

I have to admit that I am amazed there are pro-anorexia sites out there, but I guess I shouldn't be. I'm totally puzzled by that whole ultra-thin thing anyway.

I get the correlation between a good looking healthy image and modeling, but how is ultra-thin healthy or good looking?

Madison Ave is fairly dysfunctional from what I can see.


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PostPosted: Wed 16 Apr , 2008 1:44 am 
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Scary.


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PostPosted: Wed 16 Apr , 2008 3:02 am 
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Scarier:

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(She's 27 btw. Read more here.)




*E*

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PostPosted: Wed 16 Apr , 2008 3:03 am 
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Yeah, Holocaust victim much?

And to think the critics of the time called the girls in this painting "clothed skeletons."

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