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Why are Europeans thinner (on average) than Americans?

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Ara-anna
Post subject: Re: Why are Europeans thinner (on average) than Americans?
Posted: Fri 21 Nov , 2008 4:26 pm
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I think it has something to do with cheap foods being the highest in fat and calories. People tend to think that all Americas are rich and can eat the healthy foods, when in fact only our top 8% have money. The rest of us survive on mac and cheese, fatter cuts of meat and the cheap fast foods. Most likely because it's what we can afford both money and time wise.

The driving issue is big here in the west. The closest big airport is a 3 hour drive away, then we get to get on the plane and fly to our destination. Most commutes to work are on average here where I am at are over 13 miles, a good deal are over 40 miles. I am lucky as my work is 2 miles away from my house, and the grocery store is 1.5 miles away and I am considered to live within a short distance of things. However, I am not the norm, I am the exception.

I also believe the serving sizes are way too big here too. But from what I have seen the rest of the world is catching up fairly quickly in the weight issue.

Maria once said that perhaps the hormones in meat and veggies is part of the problem too, which it could be.

Or maybe its because we are headed for lean times and food will be scare so we are all stock piling our calories. :shrug:

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Rebecca
Post subject: Re: Why are Europeans thinner (on average) than Americans?
Posted: Fri 21 Nov , 2008 4:32 pm
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Nienor SharkAttack wrote:
At my old high school, soda machines were banned and water machines with free cold water came up instead. I think hardly anyone has drunk a drop of soda there ever since, everyone are bringing water bottles and filling them up. Cheaper and healthier, and you learn more when you aren't full of sugar. (In addition, people drinking soda are being looked down upon...) Point is, initiatives such as these work.
A lot of schools I know of are doing this now, too. I wouldn't be surprised to hear that my old middle and high school have done the same. Hopefully, anyway.

When I taught preschool, we put up a display once with how much sugar is in items that kids usually drink/eat. We collected wrappers from their packed lunches. We had juice containers, soda cans, yogurt wrappers, crackers, etc. And beside each one we put a sugar cube for each gram of sugar it contained. A lot of parents expressed surprise at how much sugar they were feeding their kid. I remember one mother being shocked to notice that the "100% apple juice" box she sent in still has a lot of sugar in it.

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Edit: I agree, Ara-anna. It's really frustrating shopping sometimes. I don't drink soda, but I hate that it's around $1 and I have to pay $2-$3 for juice or milk. And buying higher quality prepared foods is just so much more expensive.

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Alatar
Post subject: Re: Why are Europeans thinner (on average) than Americans?
Posted: Fri 21 Nov , 2008 4:50 pm
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Freddy, I have seen the chicken thing with my own two eyes! I had an overnight in Atlanta on my way to Nicaragua and sure enough there was fried chicken, biscuit, gravy and grits on the breakfast buffet.

I had some chicken, but I skipped the grits...

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Meril36
Post subject: Re: Why are Europeans thinner (on average) than Americans?
Posted: Fri 21 Nov , 2008 4:51 pm
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I wouldn't lay blame upon this factor alone, but there's an awful lot of corn syrup in a great many of our processed foods thanks to corn subsidies.

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elfshadow
Post subject: Re: Why are Europeans thinner (on average) than Americans?
Posted: Fri 21 Nov , 2008 4:53 pm
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It is really frustrating that healthy foods are so much more expensive than the fatty/sugary ones. I could get lunch from McDonald's for $3 that would probably contain over a thousand calories, whereas a decent salad from a healthy fast food chain would run me around $7.

As far as the differences in mentality between places with higher rates of obesity and lower rates, I can't speak for Europe but I am from Colorado, which has consistently been the state with the lowest obesity rate in the entire US (though it's still nearly 20%). I think the primary reason is, first, that Colorado tends to be a fairly affluent state. There are areas of poverty, but for the most part it's very middle class and people can afford to eat well. There's also a general mentality of exercise and healthy eating that doesn't exist in many parts of the country. There are natural or organic grocery stores like Whole Foods and Wild Oats all over the place, and I know a much higher percentage of people who are vegetarian or vegan or who eat organic foods. People also value exercise a lot--particularly outdoor exercise. It's not so much a "go to the gym" place as it is a "go for a run/hike" place. Maybe that has to do with the fact that there are so many great places to hike, and the state in general places a high value on preserving and maintaining those places. But biking or walking to work is definitely encouraged, more so than it is in DC (using that as an example because I live here now).

It's hard to explain, but I've noticed that people in Colorado tend towards organic, natural, non-synthetic items in general, and particularly when it comes to food. I think this comes with an awareness of exactly what you're eating, which is the real key to having a proper diet. A lot of it does have to do with weather and geography. The air is dry, it's sunny 300 days out of the year, and there is a lot of beautiful scenery that people like to go out and enjoy firsthand. It's a lot easier to work up the motivation to go for a run when it's 75 degrees and dry than when it's 90 degrees with 100% humidity. Maybe that's part of the reason that Southern states tend to have higher rates of obesity. It also think it does have something to do with traditional diet and portion control. A lot of the Southern people I know rave about "soul food" and "good home cooking," which is all well and good but tends to be extremely high in fat and sugar and calories. But it's also the traditional diet of places like the South, and it's difficult to move away from that mentality.


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ToshoftheWuffingas
Post subject: Re: Why are Europeans thinner (on average) than Americans?
Posted: Fri 21 Nov , 2008 5:13 pm
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Is skipping the grits some folk dance from Alabama? Is Alatar doing Porgy and Bess next?

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Ara-anna
Post subject: Re: Why are Europeans thinner (on average) than Americans?
Posted: Fri 21 Nov , 2008 5:45 pm
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ToshoftheWuffingas wrote:
Is skipping the grits some folk dance from Alabama? Is Alatar doing Porgy and Bess next?

gotta to love it Tosh. I don't know if you meant that to be funny or not, but it is.


:LMAO: :damnfunny:

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Eruname
Post subject: Re: Why are Europeans thinner (on average) than Americans?
Posted: Fri 21 Nov , 2008 5:48 pm
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I'm always perplexed when I hear any Brit say that American restaurant portions are huge, because every pub meal I've ever had has been just as large as a meal I could get in the States. I don't eat at a lot of other restaurants...have only been to Cafe Rouge and whilst their pasta dishes are smaller, their pizzas certainly aren't. I think it's hypocritical for Brits to criticise American food portions when I see plenty of huge meals here in the UK.

I think a lot of the difference is due to more walking. I've just started walking to and from work. I walk 2.3 miles each way and then also have to be on my feet for 5 hours at work. I'm pretty knackered when I get home. I could walk 10 minutes, catch a bus, then walk another 5 minutes, but the whole process doesn't save me that much more time given the route and also I guess it's better to save money and get the exercise...though I'm really resenting not having my own car as that's something I had once I was 16 back home. Now I'm almost 28 and don't have one. *grumble*

Here in the UK, I think your obesity rate is going to vary widely depending on the neighborhood and the sort of people it in. The neighborhood I live in has much more obese people. It's more poor, a fair number of council houses and people on benefits and not working. You see them with takeout, crisps packets, and sodas...all sorts of junk. Now go to Iavas's parents' village and there are hardly any obese people. They're all affluent people who tend to also have a garden and grow fruit and veg.

I've noticed women here tend to be smaller on average...not just in weight but also in height. I'd say an average American women's inseam is 31" and here it's 29". Clothes sizes are smaller here which means I don't know how I'm going to find any trousers that are big and long enough for me. Not to mention, shoes can be difficult as most stores don't carry more than a UK size 8 (US size 10...of course I'm normally a 10 1/2!)

edit: forgot to mention that I see no difference in the size of McDonald's meals here compared to the US. I'm not sure at all what Alatar(?) is talking about. Then take a look at takeaway places which give you a massive burger and an insane amount of chips!

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Post subject: Re: Why are Europeans thinner (on average) than Americans?
Posted: Fri 21 Nov , 2008 6:14 pm
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Thats been my experience Eru. Yours may differ. As for the amount of chips in a traditional chipper, yes, there's more. There's also a lot more proper potato in those chips/fries.

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Crucifer
Post subject: Re: Why are Europeans thinner (on average) than Americans?
Posted: Fri 21 Nov , 2008 6:24 pm
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Quote:
There's also a lot more proper potato in those chips/fries.
This is so true... The chipper I regularly go to uses chips that are literally just chipped potatoes, with nuthin' much else added at all.

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Eruname
Post subject: Re: Why are Europeans thinner (on average) than Americans?
Posted: Fri 21 Nov , 2008 6:27 pm
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I'm hard pressed to see much of a difference when the chips are still fried (and actually seem a bit greasier to me) and you have probably 3 times as much as you'd get in McDonalds. Not that I'm defending McDonald's (personally I think it's crap) but British takeaways are certainly no better. The other day Iavas went to a chip shop and got some meal that contained a battered burger patty! Blech!

McDonald's is a franchise that has a set size to its patties, bread buns and fries cartons so I'm not sure how experiences can really differ in that regard?

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Jude
Post subject: Re: Why are Europeans thinner (on average) than Americans?
Posted: Fri 21 Nov , 2008 6:38 pm
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When I was living there, Scotland had the highest rate for heart disease in Europe. Just about everything at a chippy was deep-fried. In fact, that was the first time I had seen a deep-fried pizza. :Q

My brother and his wife came to visit, and after a day of sight-seeing we decided to go to a chippy for dinner. Well, everything was deep-fried - including the hamburger. It was pretty disgusting, actually.

It's only in the last couple of years that I've been able to afford to go back for visits. There are a lot more choices available - the UK has undergone a food renaissance since I lived there. The organic movement seems to be flourishing, as well as awareness of ethical treatment of livestock.

But if I were to go back to that same chippy, I'd bet you that they're still deep-frying their foods. :D

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Crucifer
Post subject: Re: Why are Europeans thinner (on average) than Americans?
Posted: Fri 21 Nov , 2008 6:45 pm
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What Scotland does to food is pretty unpleasant... They literally deep fry everything.

The idea that batter is better can only be pushed so far...

ETA: And most Britons don't consider themselves Europeans anyway... ;)

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The Watcher
Post subject: Re: Why are Europeans thinner (on average) than Americans?
Posted: Fri 21 Nov , 2008 7:05 pm
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Speaking as an American here, I really think our ills are primarily due to several factors.

One is distance to easily get to places, such as work, shopping, etc. As others have pointed out, many Americans live in non urban environments, and walking and bicycling just are not options, especially for those of us in the north where winter conditions also need to be factored in. Heck, when I worked downtown, I often took a commuter bus from the burbs, but that still was the only alternative to driving, I certainly was not going to bike 18 miles one way to work.

Then, someone noted that Americans are working longer hours than ever on average, and this is true. But, an awful lot of the jobs we have are more sedentary types, they are not physically demanding. So, longer days, probably a lot more stress on families than there was even two decades ago, at least the middle classes and working classes, and people do not want to take time to cook from scratch. That is if they even know HOW to cook from scratch.

It is also true that the cruddiest foods tend to be the cheapest. Burgers and fries and fried chicken patties can be found on value menus all over the place, while a salad will cost three times as much. Huh? It makes NO sense, since I know the ingredients going into that salad are no more expensive. Soda is 1/3 the cost of a bottle of basic fruit juice or vegetable juice. Heck, often soda is cheaper than bottled water, go figure that one out!!

I understand that given current changes in demand that fresh produce and meat and other things will more than likely become more expensive, but, Americans are not generally earning more, but our basic costs are going up, so that means we also tend to stretch our money by buying cheaper less healthy foods. Too many of us do NOT grow our own food, and it is not a movement that has taken on here yet, although it might become more popular very soon.

So, basically, we need to move around more no matter how we manage to do that, watch what we eat and not sacrifice quality and nutrient content for ease and price, and stop being overworked and highly stressed. :(

edit for typos

Last edited by The Watcher on Fri 21 Nov , 2008 7:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Estel
Post subject: Re: Why are Europeans thinner (on average) than Americans?
Posted: Fri 21 Nov , 2008 7:19 pm
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I don't think it can all be blamed on eating unhealthy amounts though.

Some of you know that the massive weight gain I had was because of a medication I was on. The thing is, when I weighed the absolute most (253 lbs) I never ate fast food (ethical reasons), I didn't drink any soda, I got all my groceries from a natural foods store, was mostly vegetarian (couldn't afford meat), rode my bike for a minimum of 10 miles a day, usually more like 15, plus I had exercise classes.

Sometimes people are fat just because they're fat, not because they're unhealthy.

It's actually become a pet peeve of mine. For instance, I saw a survey on the BBC a few weeks ago where UK government was measuring the health of various towns and cities. One of their biggest factors in deciding how healthy a city was was how many overweight people there were. Not obese - just overweight. Now, I'm sorry, but being overweight does not automatically mean that you're unhealthy. For instance, I went to get a general checkup whilst I was in the UK. Blood drawn and tested for various things, blood pressure checked, etc etc. The doctor said that my heart was in fantastic shape, my cholesterol was great, my blood sugar levels were perfect, my muscle tone was better than most of the people who came into his office..... So I said, other than being a smoker, I'm healthy. The doc's response - no, you need to lose weight. If you're overweight, then you're not healthy.

How does that work? If my health, in general, is far better than most people who came into his office, why would I be unhealthy?


Whenever I watch the news I see overweight people getting demonized the same as smokers used to be. Now that countries have won the war against smoking, they need something new to concentrate on, and fat is easy. I mean, if you're fat then you're obviously ugly, stupid, lazy, you probably don't bath all that much, and you must not care much about yourself, otherwise you wouldn't be fat, you probably couldn't run for a bus if you wanted to and no doubt you're going to have a heart attack in minutes and cost the taxpayer millions in medical expenses because you don't have a job or insurance to pay for your fat ass problems yourself.

I'm tired of people equating being overweight with being unhealthy though. It simply isn't true, no more so than being too thin causes ill health. Morbid obesity and anorexic like thinness, yes - those are weight problems that will affect the health of almost every person in that kind of state. Being generally overweight or underweight though? No.


I say, so long as you are healthy, who cares if you are fat. Or skinny. Or whatever you are.


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Dave_LF
Post subject: Re: Why are Europeans thinner (on average) than Americans?
Posted: Fri 21 Nov , 2008 7:25 pm
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The Watcher wrote:
It is also true that the cruddiest foods tend to be the cheapest. Burgers and fries and fried chicken patties can be found on value menus all over the place, while a salad will cost three times as much. Huh? It makes NO sense, since I know the ingredients going into that salad are no more expensive. Soda is 1/3 the cost of a bottle of basic fruit juice or vegetable juice. Heck, often soda is cheaper than bottled water, go figure that one out!!
The explanation for both is agricultural subsidies.


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The Watcher
Post subject: Re: Why are Europeans thinner (on average) than Americans?
Posted: Fri 21 Nov , 2008 7:37 pm
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Oh, Estel, I agree.

It is odd how studies that link people's levels of stress and anxiety also pertain to weight issues, such as being overweight or underweight. The thing is, it is not so much WHAT the person eats, it is how the body and mind react to the situations. There are also metabolic issues, overall genetics and body build, and, things like you indicated that were due to medications disrupting your metabolism. Age is another factor, generally, one puts on a pound a year if all other factors NEVER change because as we age, our metabolisms slow down and our body becomes more efficient at digesting and storing extra calories. What you weighed at 20 is often NOT going to be what you weigh at 40 or 50 or 60. But, you could still be in great overall health. In fact, people that are mildly to somewhat overweight generally are in better health than those that are underweight, despite the idea that one "can never be too thin." My daughter battles even now with issues of anorexia and bulimia, which is also now crossing boundaries into other sorts of abuse. I certainly would not call her by any means "healthy."

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*E*V*E*N*S*T*A*R*
Post subject: Re: Why are Europeans thinner (on average) than Americans?
Posted: Sat 22 Nov , 2008 5:28 am
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Erunáme wrote:
forgot to mention that I see no difference in the size of McDonald's meals here compared to the US.
I did grab some McDonald's one day in London and didn't notice anything different about the taste or size (not to say there wasn't one! I was getting the shakes at that point and just needed any kind of food tbh). The price definitely got my attention, though. ;) The meals here are listed at about $5, but there it was 5 pounds. So with the exchange rate at the time, it was actually costing 2.5 times my poor little Canadian dollar.




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Post subject: Re: Why are Europeans thinner (on average) than Americans?
Posted: Sat 22 Nov , 2008 10:56 am
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To clarify on the McDonalds thing, I wasn't referring to the actual Burgers, but rather the trimmings. IIRC the side of fries they called a regular would have been a large here, and as for the Coke, well it came in practically a bucket. I'm talking at least 3 times the size.

Granted, it was mostly ice, so the Coke content may have worked out the same.

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Nin
Post subject: Re: Why are Europeans thinner (on average) than Americans?
Posted: Sat 22 Nov , 2008 3:38 pm
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I'll gladly give my input as I have recently lost 10 kilos and am quite proud of it. But I am afraid that some of you might take badly what I say.

Often, when I see pics of Americans, especially in groups, I wonder: how can so many of them be so huge? This is not about being obese, but the average person seems to be huger than in Europe. Before loosing weight I was at 67 kilos for 1m65. It felt awful for me and here in Geneva I started having trouble with buying clothes at my size (US-Size was 10 then) and I could not look any more at people - everybody was thinner than me (My BMI was still in the norm, though). There are very many thin people, especially where I live: raich neighbourhood in an already rich city. I can see that with my students too: I went to Vienna with a group of 26 students and not a single boy or girl was overweight. Neither are step-children or children, although I let them eat whatever they want.

As here so many people are thin, the social pressure is very high. You are considered as "fat" as soon as you have a few kilos more than the average. That's especially true for women. Most of my friends and my students eat careful regarding calories. I am doing that too now: I don't want to be that fat again and will do what I can to keep my weight. In my school, neither sodas nor sweets are forebidden, but there are not many over-weights anyway. Social profile is a part of it.

Most people walk more, althoug that is not true about everybody. I think the main difference is in cooking: everybody I know cooks (except my sister). My children have seen me and now M cooking countless times. They know the basics of making a meal now, even though they have not yet done it. But I start: they bake with me and they make their pizzas themselves (except four the dough). I want them to learn the basics of cooking. In school, they learn about nutrition. Usually with almost every meal there is at least one, now often two fresh vegetables on the table. Yes, it is expensive, but of course still less expensive than meat (which is prohibitive in Switzerland). Serving portions in restaurants are half of what I saw in Canada (never got to the States) at double of the price. There is nothing like "all you can eat". I saw that for the first time in the UK when I was 26... British food is horrid, sorry. When I was 15 I spent three weeks in Great-Britain and lost 10 kilos to come back on teh edge of anorexia - but I could not eat that horrible food. Don't you make any real bread with real cereales, crusty? Only toast?
On the other hand, Frend food is often very rich. If you eat that often you'd be enourmous. But then with every meal, there is a salad. And water. People just eat less and with more variety. Italian food is heavy: Pasta, Pizza... But an Italian pizza is thin and with two tranches of Mozzarella not going to make you huge. American pizza... is ...different. Canadian portions were enourmous. And if you did not eat them up, you are asked if you want to take them - this does not happen in Europe. But also within Europe, there are differences: in Germany or just already in the German speaking part of Switzerland, people are generally huger. And this despite the French cuisine.

It leads me somehow to the fact to say that the moore you cook and enjoy coooking and good quality food, less fat you will be.

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