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 Post subject: Future of Republicanism
PostPosted: Sun 19 Apr , 2009 3:24 pm 
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NPR had a pretty good feature this morning on their Weekend Edition show.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/stor ... =103257408" target="_blank

Guest Host Linda Wertheimer talks about the future of the GOP with Reihan Salam, a fellow at the New America Foundation and author of "Grand New Party," and Michelle Laxalt, a political consultant who has worked for Republican senators and the Reagan administration.

The discuss what they agree is the central problem on the Republican Party becoming a viable contender for the next two election cycles.

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PostPosted: Sun 19 Apr , 2009 3:37 pm 
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The Democratic Party won't let the Republican Party die. If they did, a party with different beliefs from the Republical-Democratic Party might replace it. In order to maintain the illusion the'll even have change over from one party ruling to the other party ruling.

If it looks like the Republican Party is actually in danger, the Democratic Party will save it.

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PostPosted: Sun 19 Apr , 2009 4:23 pm 
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The Washington Post also has a good article on the future of the Republican Party:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... id=topnews

It makes a nice bookend to the NPR radio piece.

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PostPosted: Sun 19 Apr , 2009 5:52 pm 
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Here is the nub of the argument:

Quote:
Given the state of the GOP, any sign of life in the coalition is alluring. The question is what Republicans have learned from their recent failures. How much do they acknowledge the limits of an anti-government message? How much do they acknowledge that the country that elected Obama president and gave Democrats their majorities in Congress has changed culturally and demographically from the one that gave Republicans their victories a decade ago?


(bolding mine)

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PostPosted: Sun 19 Apr , 2009 7:54 pm 
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Yes Vison, that part is central. It is not Morning in America any more. That was three decades ago. Its a whole new ballgame now. And the demographics are only going to get worse for the Republicans for the next few decades. They are increasingly the White mans party in a nation where the White man is becoming a minority in more ways than one. And when you look at their regional appeal, the picture is even more dire for them.

And once the Republicans finally accept that reality, they then have a big choice to make that both the NPR story and the newspaper article touched on: what do they do with the extreme right wing of the party when the only way you can win is to pick up significat voters in the center from Independents and Democrats?

If anyone can successfully answer that question, they should replace Michael Steele as head of the RNC.

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PostPosted: Thu 23 Apr , 2009 10:16 pm 
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Joe Klein has a pretty good article in TIME about the first 100 days of Obama as President. Near the end is a great line from a Republican about his own party:



Quote:
"We obviously haven't found our voice yet," says Senator Lamar Alexander, one of the more thoughtful GOP leaders. "The American people sent us to the woodshed. And when you go to the woodshed, the best course of action is to sit there, be quiet, figure out why you're there and what you can do about it."


It is too bad that such wisdom does not come from Steele, Palin, Pawlenty, McCain, Romney, Boehner or any other of the usual suspects.

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There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs. - John Rogers


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PostPosted: Fri 24 Apr , 2009 12:20 pm 
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http://www.latimes.com/features/health/ ... 3813.story" target="_blank

It looks like the battlelines will be drawn even more sharply - if that is possible in Washington - between Democrats supporting the policies of President Obama and the Republicans opposing those same policies.

Right now, there is a humorous commercial on TV which proclaims "we put the NO in INNOVATION". The Dems will start a series of nationwide TV spots which placethat tg firmly upon the Republicans.

part of the linked article

Quote:
In the latest sign of the combative environment, Democratic and progressive groups announced Thursday that they were launching an Internet and television campaign to promote Obama's goals and -- in some cases -- to paint Republicans as obstructionist.

The Democratic National Committee, which has absorbed Obama's campaign operation, unveiled a Web video calling the GOP the "Party of No." The ad is a montage of party leaders voicing objections to Obama's policies, ending with the words: "100 days of no."

The American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees and the group Americans United for Change will air a similar national cable ad beginning today.

The ad rattles off a series of bills that have passed since Obama took office. "Just days into the new session of Congress, Democrats expanded health insurance for children; the Republicans said no," the ad begins. "The Democrats passed equal pay for women; the Republicans said no."

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There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs. - John Rogers


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PostPosted: Fri 24 Apr , 2009 12:55 pm 
hhmmm, sounds like politics as usual. I thought Pres. Obama said that we weren't going to have to worry about this stuff anymore. Simply stating that they said "no" implies that they have no heart and are cold. There was a reason behind the no votes but giving half truths are what politics is all about. More of the same old same old, politics as usual. :roll:


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PostPosted: Fri 24 Apr , 2009 2:01 pm 
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Freddy, is it really normal politics as usual? I think it is much worse.

When was the last time you can remember the two parties being as seriously divided on votes before Congress like as has happened in these first four months? I have been following government and politics for 45 years and I cannot remember a time like today when one party was able to exercise almost complete control of their members in opposition to the President.

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There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs. - John Rogers


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PostPosted: Fri 24 Apr , 2009 6:01 pm 
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This from todays USA Today/Gallup Poll

Quote:
By more than 2-1, those surveyed credit Obama with keeping the promises he made during the campaign and making a sincere effort to work with congressional Republicans. In contrast, by 56%-38% they say congressional Republicans haven't made a sincere effort to work with him.

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There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs. - John Rogers


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PostPosted: Fri 24 Apr , 2009 11:01 pm 
SF, do I remember any other time where the congress worked against the president? Sure, you don't need to look too far, just about 12 months ago and the years preceding that. It happens with every president, the other side stands up for what they believe is right (sometimes, it's actually not politics as usual).

You probably didn't notice it before because you supported what the Dems were fighting for/against. Me, I noticed it because they were blocking things I felt were important.

I don't hold much faith in polls, it's all in HOW you ask the question and WHO you contact to ask the question. They are notorious for calling the people that will bring out the results that they want. They are like polygraph tests, it's the person asking the questions, not the machine that controls what comes to light.


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PostPosted: Fri 24 Apr , 2009 11:17 pm 
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It is incumbent on not only the majority party, but the minority party to keep the campaign promise of erasing partisanship. Can't have the Republicans always saying no, and then claiming, "see, Obama failed to unite the parties!"

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PostPosted: Sat 25 Apr , 2009 12:52 am 
At the same time you Pres. Obama and the Dems can't expect the Repubs to give up on everything. It's a vicious cycle and both sides do it when they are not in charge.

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PostPosted: Sat 25 Apr , 2009 7:31 pm 
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Unfortunately, it never ends.

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PostPosted: Tue 28 Apr , 2009 5:54 pm 
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The Republicans today losing Specter of Pennsylvania certainly does not help them. They just lost the only Jewish Republican in the Senate. They are increasingly becoming the party of the White, Male, Christian Southerner and Westerner.

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There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs. - John Rogers


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PostPosted: Tue 28 Apr , 2009 7:31 pm 
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Hey now not all the Western states are strong Republican holds, i.e., Colorado and New Mexico are both pretty liberal.

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PostPosted: Tue 28 Apr , 2009 7:43 pm 
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Quote:
The Republicans today losing Specter of Pennsylvania certainly does not help them. They just lost the only Jewish Republican in the Senate. They are increasingly becoming the party of the White, Male, Christian Southerner and Westerner.


That's an interesting description. I'm pretty sure that's not how they define themselves, but it is the way a party that defines people by what group they are in (and only by what group they are in) would define the other party. I've always considered the Republicans to be the mercantilist party, and mercantilists can be non-white, non-male, not-Christian, non-southern, and non-western.

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It is a myth that coercion is necessary in order to force people to get along together, but it is a persistent myth because it feeds a desire many people have. That desire is to be able to justify hurting people who have done nothing other than offend them in some way.

Last edited by Cenedril_Gildinaur on Tue Feb 30, 2026 13:61 am; edited 426 times in total


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PostPosted: Tue 28 Apr , 2009 8:00 pm 
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like I am the only person in America who now thinks of the Republicans as the party of the white male southerner. Its not the other group that defines them that way but their own demographics as seen by election results. Duh! The numbers are what they are.

these statistics from todays discussion over at dailykos.com

Quote:
Check it -- Republicans are now down to 40 senators, distributed in these states: AK: 1, AL: 2, AZ: 2, FL: 1, GA: 2, ID: 2, IN: 1, IA: 1, KS: 2, KY: 2, LA: 1, ME: 2, MS: 2, MO: 1, NE: 1, NH: 1, NV: 1, NC: 1, OH: 1, OK: 2, TN: 2, SC: 2, SD: 1, TX: 2, UT: 2, and WY: 2.

Republicans are present in 26 states, which doesn't sound so bad. But it means that almost half the country doesn't have any Republican Senators. Only 14 states lack a Democratic Senator.


Ohio, Missouri, New Hampshire, and North Carolina (and maybe even Florida if Crist doesn't jump in for the GOP), are all top candidates for sending two Democrats to the Senate after the 2010 elections. That would further shrink the GOP into its deep South and Mormon Corridor strongholds.


Of the GOP's remaining 40 senators, 17 of 24 come from the South (FL, NC, SC, AL, MS, GA, VA, TN, KY, LA, AR, TX). That's up from 15 after the 1998 election.


Of those remaining 40 senators, only 3 of 24 come from the Northeast (ME, VT, NY, MD, PA, CT, DE, MA, NH, RI, WV, NJ). That's down significantly from 9 after the 1998 election.


Of those remaining 40 senators, only 10 of 26 come from the West (NM, CA, OR, WA, AK, HI, MT, ID, UT, NV, AZ, WY, CO). That's down from 16 after the 1998 election.


Of those remaining 40 senators, only 10 of 26 come from the Midwest (IL, MN, MI, OH, WI, IA, MO, KS, IN, ND, SD, OK, NE). That's down from 14 after the 1998 election.
So check it -- there is only one region the GOP dominates, and it does so with a solid majority. That's the South, and there's a reason it remains the only region in the country to have a problem with our president and the Democratic majority.


Lifelong Republican conservative Pat Buchanan on MSNBC said pretty much the same thing at 4:34 PM Eastern time. He said the demographics of the changing America are against the Republican party since it is pretty much the conservative white mans party.

Ara-anna... thanks for that information and exceptions duly noted and thanked. ;)

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There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs. - John Rogers


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PostPosted: Tue 28 Apr , 2009 8:57 pm 
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I have no doubt that the Republicans will find a new coalition and come back, eventually. But for now, they seem to be spiraling down even further. They need to ditch the culture warriors. There was always cognitive dissonance--how can the party of less government interference get so involved in government prohibiting gay marriage/Terry Shiavo/abortion?


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PostPosted: Tue 28 Apr , 2009 10:00 pm 
Because those are moral/ethical issues, not issues involving the size of government.

freddy


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