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PostPosted: Thu 11 Jun , 2009 6:25 pm 
Als u het leven te ernstig neemt, mist u de betekenis.
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To be fair, it's not white supremacy per se. I see nothing that supports that, though no doubt most members feel that way and are drawn to the party from that POV. Dirty non-whites. If only they scrubbed up better they'd be more palatable to the eyes.

It's merely white segregation. Plain and simple.

Maybe it's just a hankering back to the good ol' days, where the NHS was a vibrant new thing, fish and chips was the main takeaway, radio was the main source of entertainment, and most black people were miners at the end of their shift.

I really have no truck with people who can't work the BNP from a couple of minutes on the internet rather than use this board as a springboard to vent in some way their frustration on life.

Just as I can't excuse people who are given a relatively state-of-the-art mobile phone by Estel and I as we leave the UK *explicitely* (and stressed to the point where it needs counselling) for their wife, but keep it for themselves and give the ol' immigrant ball-and-chain their old one.

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Screenshot from the upcoming ROTK: EEE. PJ, I love ya and all you've done to put us Tolkien geeks into the mainstream, but this crosses a line.


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PostPosted: Thu 11 Jun , 2009 6:46 pm 
Per aspera ad astra
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:P Lidless. (This is for the comment on Switzerland.)
I would obviously refuse any programme on national pride or values or anything like that. In my teaching assignement it is said to prepare youg people to be responsible citizens and to respect democratic values - for me value number one is: All men are born equal.

How can anybody support this? I mean seriously?

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PostPosted: Thu 11 Jun , 2009 6:50 pm 
Just keep singin'!
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Nin wrote:
How can anybody support this? I mean seriously?


Because they wrap it up in a big shiny box with pretty ribbon around it and lots of what they say SEEMS (on the face of it) to be positive. Health care. Education. Pension. Bill of rights. Blah blah blah.

I disagree that it is not a white supremacy organization. It's just so blatantly un-PC to label oneself as such, that they don't use that term. But they obviously believe that whites are BETTER than...um...you know - "OTHERS" - and are thus MORE ENTITLED to, you know, stuff. Like houses and jobs and health care and so on.


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PostPosted: Thu 11 Jun , 2009 9:32 pm 
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Um, Lidless, mind keeping those personal comments between the people involved? Thanks...


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PostPosted: Thu 11 Jun , 2009 9:55 pm 
His Rosyness

Joined: Mon 31 Jan , 2005 7:02 pm
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Quote:
Um, Lidless, mind keeping those personal comments between the people involved? Thanks...


You can't teach an old dog new tricks ;) Lidless, PM on its way.

To be fair, I regret coming back to be contentious. I've moved on from needing the internet and probably should have kept it that way. I had a silly, nostalgic, "Oh what a reaction I'd get..." moment. You're all good people and deserve better than that. Long live B77 :)

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PostPosted: Thu 11 Jun , 2009 10:09 pm 
Als u het leven te ernstig neemt, mist u de betekenis.
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yovargas wrote:
Um, Lidless, mind keeping those personal comments between the people involved? Thanks...
All fair game. Personal comments to be kept off the board are insulting ones last time I understood. Correct me if I have misunderstood.

Iavas stole the phone. It's fact. Not an opinion, nor an insult. Facts are OK here, are they not?

Anyway this is about the BNP and I was wrong to osgilliate.

I just see a bigger connection, that all. BNP supporters/sympathisers are selfish and all people are secondary. Wives included.

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PostPosted: Thu 11 Jun , 2009 10:36 pm 
bioalchemist
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Facts are fine. Personal disputes go in the Bike Racks though, if you guys want to continue stuff not BNP-related.

Regarding white supremacy in the BNP, I see the danger signs. And, of course, there is a pretty potent element of racism in any nationalist movement. Anyway, I saw this on another board I lurk on (there are other things I'm supposed to be doing today, but there's only so much code trouble-shooting me brain can take):
Quote:
In response to the comments that we have been unfairly bashing the BNP, I have written the following debate, based on real BNP opinions expressed during the Euro campaign, their website and in previous years. Of course, this is a work of fiction, the views expressed herein, unfortunately, are not.

Host: Welcome to the Great Debate. In the red corner, we have Mr Phil Pages of the BNP. Good afternoon, Phil.
Phil Pages (PP): I object. I cannot possible be in the red corner. Red is for commies and socialists. The very people who are ruining this country.
Host: Sorry, Mr Pages, there is nothing we can do.
PP: Humph.
Host: And in the blue corner, we have Mr Joe Bloggs, of the Common Sense Police. Good afternoon, Mr Bloggs.
Joe Bloggs (JB): Afternoon.
Host: Let us begin with the BNP view on racial purity, since that is the core of your policies. Mr Pages, could you tell us about your party's thoughts on that.
PP: Yes. We believe that Britain is in trouble due to the huge tide of those who would pollute the purity of the British nation. We believe in Britain for the British and will stand up for the rights of British people.
JB: Define British.
PP: What do you mean, "define British?" What are you, stupid or something?
JB: Not at all. I just want you to tell me, what do you mean by "British."
PP: What a crazy question! We all know what British means. The flag, the Union, the Queen...
JB: ...who is of German, Danish and Scottish descent.
PP: Nonsense! The Queen is the paragon of Britishness.
JB: Nope. If you read your history books you will read that her family is German and Danish, with a little Scottish mixed in.
PP: Are you crazy? She is from the house of Windsor...
JB: Which changed names during the First World War from Saxe-Coburg-Gotha, a German name, if ever there was one.
PP: Well, I, er, she is an Anglo-Saxon at least!
JB: So, what you are saying is that British means "Anglo-Saxon?"
PP: Hrumph.
JB: Because if that is what you ARE saying then you are excluding our Celtic brothers in Scotland and Ireland. Do you want to exclude them from a "racially pure" Britain?
PP: Of course not. They are British too.
JB: So I return to my question. What is British?
PP: Don't be so daft. We all know Britishness. A quiet game of cricket...
JB: a sport probably invented in Belgium.
PP: Preposterous!
JB: No, seriously. The latest research suggests it was first played in Belgium.
PP: Well then, to be British means to drink tea!
JB: First drunk in China and imported to the UK. An immigrant, if you will.
PP: Ah-ha, I have you now! To be British, you must have British parents and they must have British parents and so forth. Immigrants are not British.
JB: So, how many generations do you need to be British?
PP: The more the merrier, my old son.
JB: How many?
PP: One need not count such things. If your family is British, so are you.
JB: What if you're black?
PP: Can't be British?
JB: So the descendants of slaves imported in the 19th century are not British but those whose parents came over from France in the 20th century are?!
PP: Stop splitting hairs! You are just being silly now. Besides, to be British, you must speak English. A language of purity.
JB: No, actually it's a mongrel tongue built on several different routes from Sanskrit to Latin.
PP: Liar.
JB: No, really it is.
PP: Well, then, how would you define British?
JB: I wouldn't.
PP: How stupid! Why not?
JB: Apart from legal ideas like which passport you have, you simply CAN'T define it. Every barrier you build excludes the very things we associate with this country. If you find one that doesn't seem to, you end up with equally stupid conclusions.
PP: Ah-ha, but what if you can trace your family back to Roman days?
JB: So to be British means to be Italian? No, sir. Even then, you can't win. If you want to go that far back, you either call Britain Celtic or Roman, neither of which leads to the racial purity you seek. It can't be done.
PP: Ah but the Britons...
JB: Same Celtic family as the Bretons in France. No British at all. You see migration has always been a key factor in the history of any country. North Africans came to Britain with the Romans. Our legal system and democracy has echoes from Greece and Rome. Our food hails from India, Pakistan, Italy, France, Greece, pretty much everywhere but here!
PP: I can't believe it.
JB: Ah but you must.
Host: Thank you, gentlemen for your debate today.

Hardly unbiased, but it makes a point.

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PostPosted: Thu 11 Jun , 2009 10:57 pm 

Joined: Thu 03 Mar , 2005 8:22 pm
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Location: Queensland, Australia
As it stands now, the BNP simply remains a steady but minor player in British politics. They've been around for a while and I've never given them too much thought. They haven't managed to win so much as a single Commons seat, and while these sorts of movements enjoy periodic surges of support (as in France in 2002) they generally don't get anywhere significant. There are far, far more interesting things going on in British politics now than the BNP winning a couple of seats in the EU Parliament.

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PostPosted: Fri 12 Jun , 2009 5:38 am 
Just keep singin'!
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Suspect in US Holocaust museum guard killing has links to BNP
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/ju ... -von-brunn

From today's Guardian.


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PostPosted: Fri 12 Jun , 2009 8:43 am 
Filthy darwinian hobbit
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To propose that the BNP is not supremacist but merely segregationalist is remarkably generous to them though I expect they clothe their views with segregationalist proposals.
Pah, they are nothing more than thugs and Lord M is right. They operate on the margins and in trouble areas attempting to make things worse to benefit themselves.They get far more attention in the Press than their support warrants because of their outrageous views. What concerns me far more is the insidious concentration day on day by some of our tabloid press on immigration. This has been going on for years and years and that is what feeds the BNP. It is a disgrace and it sickens me. But the press is owned by millionnaires so what can we do?

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PostPosted: Fri 12 Jun , 2009 9:06 am 
Just keep singin'!
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Iavas_Saar wrote:
...I regret coming back to be contentious. I've moved on from needing the internet and probably should have kept it that way. I had a silly, nostalgic, "Oh what a reaction I'd get..." moment.


So, you were trolling after all?

:tsktsk:


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PostPosted: Fri 12 Jun , 2009 1:04 pm 
Aspiring to heresy
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Yeah, that is the exact definition of trolling.

Let's keep him talking until sunrise, and see what happens. :devil:

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PostPosted: Sat 13 Jun , 2009 8:35 pm 
Takoyaki is love
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I just wanted to point out that if there is a strangled hold on immigration, who is going to pay the taxes to support the aging baby-boomers? That is the the main goal of immigration. (There not enough "white" people to fill this gap, sorry to break it to you.) Also many of those brown countries do have prestigious schools and the people who come from those brown countries are usually highly educated. A part of it is that some employers do not recognize their credentials and don't want to do the research and hire them. One of my friends goes through resumes and saw that one guy graduated from a major technology school in India and basically set up an interview immediately. Most employers in Canada don't know about the school.

Also how the heck did England and much of Europe become so rich? Uh, colonization anyone? They out and out took the wealth from the "third world" countries now don't want to give foreign aid? Not to mention once the developing countries become m ore developed it fosters a beneficial relationship.

At one point Canada was a developing country (like 1800's) and now that it is a developed country they don't forget who helped them. You'd rather these "third world" countries become friendly with China?

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PostPosted: Sun 14 Jun , 2009 12:45 pm 
Filthy darwinian hobbit
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Wot Wilma sed.

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PostPosted: Mon 15 Jun , 2009 9:57 pm 
You are hearing me talk

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Ah, but what do you do when the immigrants you import to support the boomers themselves become old and require support? Do you just keep importing or producing more and more people forever and ever in order to maintain an ever-increasing population of retirees?


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PostPosted: Mon 15 Jun , 2009 10:05 pm 
bioalchemist
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Either that or you just let the population re-equilibrate. But that's all kinds of ugly.

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