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President Obama wins Nobel Peace Prize

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Post subject: Re: President Obama wins Nobel Peace Prize
Posted: Fri 09 Oct , 2009 7:42 pm
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Well John Hume and David Trimble won it for "bringing peace to Northern Ireland". I don't think anyone in Ireland would have credited those two particular people. In reality, it should have been given to the terrorists on both sides of the divide who agreed to disarm and come to the table. But that doen't loom so good does it? Sometimes its a symbolic gesture.

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Lidless
Post subject: Re: President Obama wins Nobel Peace Prize
Posted: Fri 09 Oct , 2009 9:08 pm
Als u het leven te ernstig neemt, mist u de betekenis.
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The "He's Not George Bush" prize is awarded to...

It seems the Nobel Prize is now being awarded ahead of time.

*checks recent physics winners*

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Post subject: Re: President Obama wins Nobel Peace Prize
Posted: Fri 09 Oct , 2009 9:51 pm
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Wilma
Post subject: Re: President Obama wins Nobel Peace Prize
Posted: Fri 09 Oct , 2009 10:58 pm
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I think it's the "thanks for not being Bush" prize. That was my second thought when I heard this.

I don't think he has done much and I was very surprised he received. Especially since he was in power for only a month, when the deadline for nominations was up. I did appreciate his message to the Muslim world and stuff, but that is just a step in the right direction. He hasn't accomplished anything major yet.

The support is nice but, when such a prize is awarded it should not be surrounded by questions.

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Lurker
Post subject: Re: President Obama wins Nobel Peace Prize
Posted: Sat 10 Oct , 2009 2:44 am
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Something to ponder on people.....

Below is a brief description of the process involved in selecting the Nobel Peace Prize Laureates.

February – Deadline for submission. The Committee bases its assessment on nominations that must be postmarked no later than 1 February each year. Nominations postmarked and received after this date are included in the following year's discussions. In recent years, the Committee has received close to 200 different nominations for the Nobel Peace Prize. The number of nominating letters is much higher, as many are for the same candidates.

Hmm... Obama just got inagurated President a few weeks ago, since the deadline for nominations was Feb.1, what was the basis for his nomination? His inaugural speech? :scratch:

February-March – Short list. The Committee assesses the candidates' work and prepares a short list.

Two months in office, what did he do more speeches? :scratch:

March-August – Adviser review. The short list is reviewed by permanent advisers and advisers specially recruited for their knowledge of specific candidates. The advisers do not directly evaluate nominations nor give explicit recommendations.

So are they basing this on his speeches during the campaign? :scratch:

Man, pass me the extra strength tylenol. :bang:

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sauronsfinger
Post subject: Re: President Obama wins Nobel Peace Prize
Posted: Sat 10 Oct , 2009 3:27 am
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Lurker
please read this selection from an article including interview comments with the Committee chairperson.
Quote:
While much admired around the world, the announcement still came as a surprise as some Nobel observers believe it is too early in his presidency for Barack Obama to receive the award. Jagland firmly disagrees. "If you look at the history of the Nobel Peace Prize, we have on many occasions tried to enhance what many personalities is [are] trying to do," Jagland noted. "For instance, when Willy Brandt got the prize back in the 1970s, he launched Ostpolitik in Europe which was so important in what happened many years later. For instance giving the prize to Mikhail Gorbachev for changing the world completely and now to President Obama who is contributing to improve the international climate, to strengthen the international bodies such as the UN for instance and that is very, very much needed. And the committee wants to not only endorse, but contribute to enhancing that kind of international policy and the attitudes which he stands for."
The idea that the Nobel Peace Prize is only given for past accomplishments is clearly not a standard of the Committee which gives the award.

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Lurker
Post subject: Re: President Obama wins Nobel Peace Prize
Posted: Sat 10 Oct , 2009 3:40 am
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President Obama who is contributing to improve the international climate

Where did they base this then? His campaign speeches? I posted that the nominations ended on Feb. 1, 2009. So two weeks into his Presidency he already contributed in improving the international climate. How? More speeches? With "Hope"?

Man, the committee should be awarded the "Physics" award for quantum leaping into the future.

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LalaithUrwen
Post subject: Re: President Obama wins Nobel Peace Prize
Posted: Sat 10 Oct , 2009 3:49 am
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I agree, Lurker.

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Estel
Post subject: Re: President Obama wins Nobel Peace Prize
Posted: Sat 10 Oct , 2009 10:26 am
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I do think it was too early for him to get it, and that he should not have gotten it.

However, there are many people in the world who are complaining that all he has done so far is talk. Considering we had to wait almost a decade for a president who would talk and negotiate, rather than threaten war, I really don't think this is a valid complaint. Diplomacy is made up of talking. A lot of very boring talking. It's not very interesting, it's not dramatic, it's not sudden. It is, however, extremely important.

Complaining that all he does is talk is like complaining that all Alexander Fleming did was watch mold grow.

So no, Obama shouldn't have won the prize, but saying that he shouldn't have because all he has done is talk and give speeches is bullshit. He should not have won because we don't know, yet, how much difference his talking and speeches have made in the arena of world diplomacy. Granted, all is well in Europe again - everyone has gone back to hating Germany instead of the U.S. :blackeye: (it's a joke!)


I'll never dismiss talking out of hand though. It's far more pivotal than people seem to be willing to admit. After all, extensive communication, through talking, is what gives us the ability to live in a civil manner. That's pretty damned significant.

Last edited by Estel on Sat 10 Oct , 2009 10:40 am, edited 3 times in total.

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Lidless
Post subject: Re: President Obama wins Nobel Peace Prize
Posted: Sat 10 Oct , 2009 10:26 am
Als u het leven te ernstig neemt, mist u de betekenis.
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Jagland obviously does not understand his own statutes as laid out by Nobel himself.

"...and one part to the person who shall have done the most or the best work for fraternity between nations, for the abolition or reduction of standing armies and for the holding and promotion of peace congresses."

Sounds past tense to me.

This really is a joke.

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Nienor SharkAttack
Post subject: Re: President Obama wins Nobel Peace Prize
Posted: Sat 10 Oct , 2009 11:14 am
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Lurker wrote:
Where did they base this then? His campaign speeches? I posted that the nominations ended on Feb. 1, 2009. So two weeks into his Presidency he already contributed in improving the international climate. How? More speeches? With "Hope"?
But does it say anywhere that the Committee only considers what the person has done at the time of the nomination? Even if he was nominated back then, the decision to give him the prize wasn't taken until very, very recently. And I'm quite sure they took into account the eight months that has gone by since February.

That someone nominated him that early (which I too think is way too soon), isn't the Committee's fault.

Lidless wrote:
...the person who shall have done the most or the best work for fraternity between nations...
I do think Obama has done that.

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Lurker
Post subject: Re: President Obama wins Nobel Peace Prize
Posted: Sat 10 Oct , 2009 3:05 pm
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Nienor SharkAttack wrote:
Lurker wrote:
Where did they base this then? His campaign speeches? I posted that the nominations ended on Feb. 1, 2009. So two weeks into his Presidency he already contributed in improving the international climate. How? More speeches? With "Hope"?
But does it say anywhere that the Committee only considers what the person has done at the time of the nomination? Even if he was nominated back then, the decision to give him the prize wasn't taken until very, very recently. And I'm quite sure they took into account the eight months that has gone by since February.

That someone nominated him that early (which I too think is way too soon), isn't the Committee's fault.
So Nienor, any thoughts on why he was nominated in the first place, if they based the award on his eight months of doing nothing in office. (I can't help but love that Saturday Night Live skit.) I don't want to enumerate it again since the "fanbase" is getting upset with me. :P

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Nienor SharkAttack
Post subject: Re: President Obama wins Nobel Peace Prize
Posted: Sat 10 Oct , 2009 3:22 pm
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Lurker wrote:
So Nienor, any thoughts on why he was nominated in the first place, if they based the award on his eight months of doing nothing in office.
I already told you I don't think it was a good idea of whoever did it to nominate him two weeks after he took office. But the Committee did not nominate him, and it did not give him the prize for what he did during those two weeks, but what he has done in the eight months after. Which is not nothing.

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Lurker
Post subject: Re: President Obama wins Nobel Peace Prize
Posted: Sat 10 Oct , 2009 3:28 pm
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Nienor SharkAttack wrote:
Lurker wrote:
So Nienor, any thoughts on why he was nominated in the first place, if they based the award on his eight months of doing nothing in office.
I already told you I don't think it was a good idea of whoever did it to nominate him two weeks after he took office. But the Committee did not nominate him, and it did not give him the prize for what he did during those two weeks, but what he has done in the eight months after. Which is not nothing.

Give specifics what did he do in his eight months in office, then?
Give a stimulus package to the banks? Give sweeping speeches? Bid for the Olympics? Comment on Kayne West? :P

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Lurker
Post subject: Re: President Obama wins Nobel Peace Prize
Posted: Sat 10 Oct , 2009 3:31 pm
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Lurker wrote:
Nienor SharkAttack wrote:
Lurker wrote:
So Nienor, any thoughts on why he was nominated in the first place, if they based the award on his eight months of doing nothing in office.
I already told you I don't think it was a good idea of whoever did it to nominate him two weeks after he took office. But the Committee did not nominate him, and it did not give him the prize for what he did during those two weeks, but what he has done in the eight months after. Which is not nothing.

Give specifics what did he do in his eight months in office, then?
Give a stimulus package to the banks? Give sweeping speeches? Bid for the Olympics? Comment on Kayne West? :P

I think you should delete "not" from that sentence. :LMAO:

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Estel
Post subject: Re: President Obama wins Nobel Peace Prize
Posted: Sat 10 Oct , 2009 4:11 pm
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Lurker - being derisive isn't necessarily the best way to debate seriously.



As I said above, I don't think he should've won it.

He has, however, done quite a bit since he's been in office. It's probably not covered very well in the U.S., however, the speech he gave in Cairo went a long way towards a more friendly attitude towards the U.S. from the Middle East, as well as his willingness to talk rather than threaten. Most Europeans I've spoken to have a much softer attitude towards the U.S. with him in office, and have more respect for us as a country for voting him in. We're not so much seen as a bunch of blithering bullies. That's two things that are rather huge. Add in bringing healthcare to the forefront, the various meetings with world rulers, giving more credence to the UN, and, indeed, actively participating with the UN. How about only taking 1 week off for a vacation, as opposed to Bush who took the entire month of August off in his first year.

Diplomacy is a long and quiet process where it looks like not much is going on until it's done. Think of it as filling a huge pool with water from a single hose. Obama is a diplomat.

No, he should not have won. Saying that he has not done anything, however, is just showing your own ignorance.



Also, you're arguing in the style of Glenn Beck - "I'm not saying he didn't do anything, but prove to me that he did."
Glenn Beck to first-ever Muslim congressman wrote:
"I have been nervous about this interview with you, because what I feel like saying is, 'Sir, prove to me that you are not working with our enemies.' I'm not accusing you of being an enemy, but that's the way I feel, and I think a lot of Americans will feel that way."

It's a bullshit tactic. Have a little class in your debating style please.

Last edited by Estel on Sat 10 Oct , 2009 4:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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sauronsfinger
Post subject: Re: President Obama wins Nobel Peace Prize
Posted: Sat 10 Oct , 2009 4:21 pm
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Well here is the Glen Beck Peace Prize award winner
Quote:
Beck: “The Nobel Peace Prize should be turned down by Barack Obama and given … to the Tea Party goers and the 9-12 Project because — because of the arrogance … because of the arrogance of the progressives that thought no one would stand in their way, that he would be able to accomplish everything. Two weeks into his presidency, they nominated him for it and said, oh, this is going to be a slam dunk. And because of the Tea Party goers and the 9-12 Project people that stood in his way and stopped him from accomplishing the things that he thought — please, I’m the messiah. I’ll be able to accomplish that. We have now seen — we are now pulling the curtain back and seeing, oh, wait a minute, he just got an award for doing things he couldn’t get done. Hmm.”
You gotta wonder how the Committee in Oslo missed that one?

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Estel
Post subject: Re: President Obama wins Nobel Peace Prize
Posted: Sat 10 Oct , 2009 4:24 pm
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That guy is a piece of work :roll:


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LalaithUrwen
Post subject: Re: President Obama wins Nobel Peace Prize
Posted: Sat 10 Oct , 2009 4:29 pm
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Sorry to be cross-posting everywhere. :neutral:

I agree with this assessment [an observation Cerin made on HoF]. What bothers me, and this could be complete naivete on my part, is that I didn't think the NPP was politically-based in this way. So, for me, it somewhat diminishes the credibility and prestige of the award. But, then again, I am probably just glorifying something that has been politically-driven from the beginning.

I mean, obviously, I know politics are involved. You can't be a peacemaker on this level without it involving countries, social issues, and the like. But giving the award to Obama at this stage in the game seems to imply that the committee cares more about their own ideologies or political agendas than acknowledging or rewarding someone who has actually accomplished a great deal toward peacemaking.

(And I do agree with what Estel said on b77, that we shouldn't diminish the importance of talking, that this is a huge part of being a diplomat, and it's a very important part. It's just that, well, Nelson Mandela vs. Barack Obama?? The proof is not in the pudding yet, so to speak.)

In my opinion, of course.

ETA: That being said, it does feel kind of nice to have the world not hate us quite so much anymore.

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sauronsfinger
Post subject: Re: President Obama wins Nobel Peace Prize
Posted: Sat 10 Oct , 2009 4:39 pm
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The really interesting thing about the Beck nomination of the Teabaggers ... if you ignore the fact that his employers were the ones who largely helped fund, organize and publicize the events to gain ratings and attention for themselves, and take the nomination seriously on its "merits" you have to ask yourself this question: if we criticize the Nobel Committee for giving the award to President Obama on the grounds that he really did little or nothing to deserve it, what then did the Teabaggers do to deserve it? Their purpose was to stop Obama in his tracks from enacting any sort of health care program which would increase the power and scope of government among other similar goals. That battle is still being fought. So what have they accomplished other than a lot of noise and drawing attention to themselves? It seems that Beck is no stranger to hypocrisy.

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