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TWT
Post subject: Heroes
Posted: Thu 14 Dec , 2006 6:20 am
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OK, I'm surprised I've heard no one here talking about this show.

It's one of the best shows I've seen in ages. Beats Lost by a mile and a half.

http://www.nbc.com/Heroes/

If I'm not mistaken, the show takes a hiatus until the middle of January. It's only 11 episodes in. Download them or something! The first 11 episodes so you can watch the rest of this awesome show!

Oooo. I just saw on that link above that you can watch all episodes online.

This show just gets better and better and makes more and more sense as it goes on.


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MaidenOfTheShieldarm
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Posted: Thu 14 Dec , 2006 8:34 am
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How funny that you should post this now. I was literally just thinking of doing the same thing.

I was really looking forward to this show, having seen the many commercials that NBC showed this summer.

Then, of course, first set scheduled production meetings at the exact time it was showing. So I missed a lot, but really liked what I saw. The actor in the show I'm working on now told me a few days ago that all the episodes were up online, and so I just finished watching the first and second ones, of which I'd seen only half of the first one. (Sorry, unnecessary exposition. It's late.)

I love this show. It's as good as Season 1 of Lost, better than the rest of Lost. I love how character driven it is (which is what sets it apart from Seasons 2&3 of Lost IMO). The story lines are fascinating, and the characters that drive them are equally compelling. Peter and Hiro are easily my favourites.

I really wish he hadn't told me the other day that they were up -- I should have been doing work, but ended up spending two hours watching instead. :P Can't wait to watch the rest.

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Elian
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Posted: Thu 14 Dec , 2006 6:03 pm
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I adore this show...definitely the best of the new season, and fast becoming my overall favorite.

Definitely better than Lost, as this show actually gives answers once in a while, as well as more questions to keep the story moving...

And there's so many questions to speculate on!! ;)




Plus, the amount of eye-candy doesn't hurt. :devil:

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halplm
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Posted: Thu 14 Dec , 2006 6:14 pm
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Yeah, I was going to say something if you didn't mention the eye-candy!

lucky women...

It is an excellent show. It's the only one I'm consistently looking forward to.


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TWT
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Posted: Thu 14 Dec , 2006 6:53 pm
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Elian wrote:
Definitely better than Lost, as this show actually gives answers once in a while, as well as more questions to keep the story moving...
I completely agree! It gives you just enough to keep you wondering the following week. I watched Lost for almost two seasons and got no answers at all. Just more questions. :neutral:

Of everyone here I expected at least Hal to be watching. :D

Favorite character has to be Hiro hands down. He's an awesome character!


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*E*V*E*N*S*T*A*R*
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Posted: Thu 14 Dec , 2006 7:11 pm
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Count me in as someone who was also going to start a thread on this. Bah. Knew I should've jumped in there earlier. :P

I feel the need to defend Lost, and not just because I know you don't watch it much, TWT. ;) There is a backlash this season and Heroes is filling that excitement for a lot of people, but soon as they tire of it as well, the same complaints will be made. That's just my opinion. Heroes is the shiny new toy, but let's wait a couple seasons before calling it the second coming of Christ, as so many are. :roll: Also, Tim Kring is pals with the creators of Lost and there are a lot of similarities, so yeah, I'm not ready to bend over for them just yet.

Sorry to sound like I don't love it or anything. Not at all the case. In addition to Wednesdays, my Monday nights are now completely scheduled around a tv show and I'm happy to do it. :P Masi Oka is an absolute treasure, and I'm totally in love with Milo Ventimiglia. :drool: There are a lot of exciting things that happen in the show, and only two episodes didn't seem to move the story along much. Any time the previously mentioned actors are on screen, I'm a happy viewer, though, so its fine.

On the downside, I don't care for any of the female characters. Claire is alright, but I've seen this girl grow up in the tabloids, so its kind of hard to take her seriously sometimes knowing what a ho she is in real life. :P She's my favorite chick on the show by a longshot, though. Niki is a total bore. Eden is a bad actress. Matt's wife is obnoxious. Guess that's one way to get more female viewership. Or alienate them. *shrug* I loved Charlie, so of course she dies after a couple of minutes. At least I can see her in the upcoming EPIC MOVIE, part of the Scary Movie/Date Movie franchise.

There is a lot of bad writing on the show, but the proceedings kind of distract from that, depending on which character or actor we're looking at. A poor Hiro scene is miles better than a poor Mohinder scene.

Looking forward to January 22nd. Heroes is one show that makes me very comfortable in knowing that the story will keep moving ahead and provide me with a number of great characters to watch in the meantime.

Congrats to Masi Oka for his Golden Globe nomination.

EDIT
MaidenOfTheShieldarm wrote:
Peter and Hiro are easily my favourites.
That's my girl. :D [ img ]

EDIT 2: wow, I'm just looking at the premiere for Rocky Balboa (Milo plays his son) and half the cast of the show turned up to support him. Cool! Maybe that means they're all really close friends, or NBC is whoring them out wherever possible. :P

http://community.livejournal.com/ohnoth ... 26763.html




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TWT
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Posted: Thu 14 Dec , 2006 8:18 pm
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Bah, this show is already miles better than Lost was 11 episodes in. And Heroes probably won't take 8 freakin' seasons to develop!

At least in Heroes half the show does not consist of epicly boring flashbacks. I watched Lost and was a huge fan. Until I found out I'd almost be 30 years old by the time it finishes. I stopped watching because I don't want to plan the next 8 years of my life around a show that seems to be going nowhere at all.

Heroes is a better premise and more entertaining.


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Elian
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Posted: Thu 14 Dec , 2006 8:29 pm
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*E* wrote:
There is a backlash this season and Heroes is filling that excitement for a lot of people, but soon as they tire of it as well, the same complaints will be made.
This may well be true...in fact, I'd fully expect more complaints next season, since as the show goes along, some viewers aren't going to get what they want out of it pretty much by default. You can never please everyone. However, I don't see a Lost-sized backlash in the future, if for no other reason than the Heroes writers, at this time, have said they have a plan for next season, at least. The reason Lost has gathered such a backlash this season (and last season, to be frank) is because...well, it sucks. They had a promising first season and they've been stringing viewers along ever since, because, imo, they have no freakin clue where the story is going and are making it up as they go along. It's only natural that people should get tired of it...hence Heroes seeming like the 'second coming' when they actually dare to answer some questions within an 11-episode time frame. Shocking. Of course there will be backlash, but it is possible for a show with a good first season to retain that quality or even improve in its second season, so I have hope. ;)

I'll agree with you about the female characters...oy. They need to get Niki's storyline resolved or get her offscreen, pronto.

I'm hoping that now that Mohinder will be connected to the others more, he won't be such a damn bore all the time...cause he is nice to look at, so I hate to snooze through his scenes. He also seems to get stuck with the majority of the bad writing. Hiro is lucky in that so far...even bad writing sounds much better in subtitles. ;)

Hal wrote:
Yeah, I was going to say something if you didn't mention the eye-candy!
I don't know what you mean...it isn't as if I'm obsessed with Peter or anything... :halo:

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*E*V*E*N*S*T*A*R*
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Posted: Fri 15 Dec , 2006 8:25 am
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TWT wrote:
Bah, this show is already miles better than Lost was 11 episodes in.
A lot of productions that ride on the coattails of others have that sort of advantage. :)
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Heroes is a better premise and more entertaining.
It had better be. For a first season, no program should be boring or run out of steam. Beyond that, however...

I see a lot of problems developing with the Mohinder character. He's nice to look at, but the character and his scenes are total snorefests. I don't even listen to his narration. Then there's Greg Grunberg who, though a cutie and nice person, ain't too hot in the acting department and sometimes is embarrassing to watch (like when he was trying to hear Mr. Bennet and the Haitian's thoughts, just before his nosebleed - good lord, it was like watching Matt LeBlanc's character from Friends). The acting on Lost is uniformly excellent, not just a few bright spots here and there.

Heroes also benefits from the current popularity of comic books and superhero movies out there. Batman Begins, Superman Returns, X-Men, Spiderman, The Incredibles, Fantastic Four, and Sin City for example. Instead of waiting two or three years for our favorite characters to return, we get them in small doses every single week. Lost is most closely tied to Survivor, and I mean, its popular and all, but nothing like superhero movies are. :P

El, I agree with pretty much everything you said. I understand where the Lost backlash comes from, but it still annoys me because of it's relation to people's obsessive nature and how they blame someone else for them not being able to find the positive in something that was good enough for them to be interested in the first place. If I watch a show from the begining, I see people with short attention spans hate it and get it cancelled. But if I wait until it's been around a few seasons well, I've missed too many episodes to get into it. Its a confusing balancing act. :P There's been no show I've stuck with from begining to end in my entire life, so while I wish Lost would hurry up sometimes, I'm not ready to bail yet, and it's also why I'm not 100% on the Heroes train yet because already, I see where the cracks are forming and that is always a sign that I'll have extreme problems later on. But overall, its a case of feeling defensive of an original product when other things take their good ideas and run with it. Like how MOULIN ROUGE broke down a lot of barriers when it came to modern musicals, so when CHICAGO came around I was like, "guys! It wouldn't be here if MR hadn't been successful, so let's give credit where credit is due." :P And I always looked at Harry Potter as LOTR for kids, so even when there is a lot to enjoy in it, I have to stick to my LOTR roots. ;)

Anyway.




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Lidless
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Posted: Fri 15 Dec , 2006 8:35 am
Als u het leven te ernstig neemt, mist u de betekenis.
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I know nothing about this show, and haven't seen a single episode.

But from what I've heard, it's reminiscent in a way of The Water Margin - a Japanese show from the 70's based a millenia ago in China where the souls of dead heros came back and inhabited people of the day.

What questions are being answered? How they came to get their powers? The reason for it?

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*E*V*E*N*S*T*A*R*
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Posted: Fri 15 Dec , 2006 8:40 am
I've cried a thousand oceans, and I would cry a thousand more if that's what it takes to sail you home.
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Was the Water Margin written by L. Ron Hubbard, by any chance?




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Elian
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Posted: Fri 15 Dec , 2006 10:00 am
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*E* wrote:
I see a lot of problems developing with the Mohinder character. He's nice to look at, but the character and his scenes are total snorefests. I don't even listen to his narration. Then there's Greg Grunberg who, though a cutie and nice person, ain't too hot in the acting department and sometimes is embarrassing to watch (like when he was trying to hear Mr. Bennet and the Haitian's thoughts, just before his nosebleed - good lord, it was like watching Matt LeBlanc's character from Friends). The acting on Lost is uniformly excellent, not just a few bright spots here and there.
...To each their own, I suppose. Greg Grunberg is very highly thought of by most fans, and has been since his days on Alias, so far as I know. And there are plenty of actors on Lost who could be picked at for their acting skills, or lack thereof...I myself was baffled by EL's Golden Globe nom, until I saw Beyonce had one as well and remember that the GGs mean absolutely nothing...but I digress. I'd say the only actor on Lost who is 'uniformly excellent' is Terry O'Quinn.
*E* wrote:
Heroes also benefits from the current popularity of comic books and superhero movies out there.
You do realize that Heroes was widely expected to be the biggest flop of the new season, right? Popular in movies or not, comic-based stories don't generally have widespread popularity in mainstream culture, especially not for an ongoing thing like a tv series starring a bunch of nobodies (in terms of actors and characters...much easier to do a show based on established characters like Superman or Batman or even the X-Men than a bunch of new heroes).
*E* wrote:
El, I agree with pretty much everything you said. I understand where the Lost backlash comes from, but it still annoys me because of it's relation to people's obsessive nature and how they blame someone else for them not being able to find the positive in something that was good enough for them to be interested in the first place. If I watch a show from the begining, I see people with short attention spans hate it and get it cancelled. But if I wait until it's been around a few seasons well, I've missed too many episodes to get into it. Its a confusing balancing act.
Of course, it's also possible that those who don't like Lost anymore don't like it for...legitimate reasons, no? Not everyone is a disgruntled, impatient, whiny fanboy who can't see the good in anything. Perhaps what was good in the show simply wasn't enough to balance out all the negative factors for those viewers...it's not a crime.

As for not wanting to start watching shows because they're in the middle of their run currently...that's what DVDs are for. ;)

Oh, and I really don't think that Heroes is riding on the coattails of Lost, by any means. The only thing they have in common is a fantastical element, and since Lost seems to have dropped that bit a season ago, well...
Oddly enough, the shows which were similar to Lost in that they were highly serialized and featured a story told through flashbacks/characters connected by amazing coincidence (The Nine and Six Degrees) are pretty well sealed as failures. Make of that what you will.

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*E*V*E*N*S*T*A*R*
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Posted: Fri 15 Dec , 2006 10:56 am
I've cried a thousand oceans, and I would cry a thousand more if that's what it takes to sail you home.
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Elian wrote:
And there are plenty of actors on Lost who could be picked at for their acting skills, or lack thereof...I myself was baffled by EL's Golden Globe nom, until I saw Beyonce had one as well and remember that the GGs mean absolutely nothing...but I digress. I'd say the only actor on Lost who is 'uniformly excellent' is Terry O'Quinn.
Ditto on the EL nod, but I couldn't disagree more about the rest of the cast. Matthew Fox is one of the best criers ever :P and Josh Holloway is the reason I got into the show. Terry O'Quinn is amazing, same goes for Daniel Dae Kim, Naveen Andrews, Adewale Akinnuoye-Agbaje, Henry Ian Cusick, Elizabeth Mitchell, and Sam Anderson, to name a few. Its a really strong cast. The only Heroes that compare are Masi Oka, Jack Coleman, and Milo Ventimiglia, with Hayden Panettiere, and Leonard Roberts showing some promise.
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You do realize that Heroes was widely expected to be the biggest flop of the new season, right?
I never heard of it until I watched the first episode.
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Not everyone is a disgruntled, impatient, whiny fanboy who can't see the good in anything.
That's not what I said at all. I was responding to those who were because that's who I'm around the most. TWoP, IMDb, LJ, etc... you see how people react to what's popular and how quickly they give up on it.
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As for not wanting to start watching shows because they're in the middle of their run currently...that's what DVDs are for. ;)
I can't afford $60 for every show I'm interested in. It's all very tricky.
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Oddly enough, the shows which were similar to Lost in that they were highly serialized and featured a story told through flashbacks/characters connected by amazing coincidence (The Nine and Six Degrees) are pretty well sealed as failures. Make of that what you will.
Yeah, last year saw Invasion and Threshold cancelled pretty quickly as well.

The similarities between Lost and Heroes I saw were the inter-connecting backgrounds, characters of many different races and cultures, scenes taking place all over the world, both have a wonder kid, a drug-addict, and a couple from Asia. Its more the overall tone and similarities between characters, but yeah. The more I watched it, the more I can separate each show, but Tim Kring is not the most original of writers, which is why I have my eye on it. ;)

EDIT: oh, and two of the more mysterious and potentially dangerous characters (Locke and Mr. Bennet) are both revealed to have worked in a paper company, right? Bennet's job is probably more of a front, but still. :P




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oldtoby
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Posted: Fri 15 Dec , 2006 5:53 pm
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Lidless wrote:
What questions are being answered? How they came to get their powers? The reason for it?
Well I've only seen 3 or 4 eps so far but they seem to be hinting its genetic. Its very much a sort of X-Men variant (I noticed in the credits that Jeph Loeb was involved, he was/is a writer for several X-Men series) with the setting and characters much more grounded in reality, rather than in the uber-fantastical element of comics.

Its been interesting so far, a nice replacement while I wait for LOST to return. :)

Good thing I got a DVR in case both shows end up on at the same time. ;)


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*E*V*E*N*S*T*A*R*
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Posted: Fri 15 Dec , 2006 5:58 pm
I've cried a thousand oceans, and I would cry a thousand more if that's what it takes to sail you home.
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I hope that will never be the case. :Q

Heroes is on Mondays and Lost Wednesdays, so we should be safe, toby.




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TWT
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Posted: Fri 15 Dec , 2006 6:43 pm
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I agree with El here, I don't think Heroes is riding on the coattails of Lost by any means. The shows are very different. Heroes contains action sequences, for one...

I've been trying to say that I was a Lost fan. I didn't think the show was horrid from the beginning. I was optomistic and thought that perhaps the flashbacks would stop once we got to know the characters better but no, they keep on with them.

Heroes did have one or two boring shows, but they did advance the plot though they weren't all that fun. Lost has had legions of boring shows that do nothing. I remember vividly the episode that was all about the Chineese woman's lost wedding ring. I thought the show had finally come to a conclusion and that all along what the show was really going to be about was a "Lost" wedding ring. If I want to watch a drama about relationships and problems I'll watch the OC. Lost was supposed to be an adventure and if they want to achieve and have a brilliant show then they can't be both at the same time having one episode about relationships and the next where they walk for half a day in a forrest, find something mysterious of which the origen will undoubtedly be revealed in the 6th season.

It has nothing to do with patience. A show is either good or it isn't, I have Lost a chance devoting my wednesday evenings to it for ayear and a half and now I don't because the show that showed so much promise has completely gone and beaten itself to death with it's own horrific plotlines.

Heroes is refreshing. It always leaves you waiting for the next episode and then delivers. Lost would kinda make me look forward to the next episode and when it finally was wednesday again the show decided to follow a different plotline.

I don't like Lost for the same reason I didn't like the new Bond film. It's choppy and all over the place instead of focusing on a central plot.


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*E*V*E*N*S*T*A*R*
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Posted: Fri 15 Dec , 2006 6:49 pm
I've cried a thousand oceans, and I would cry a thousand more if that's what it takes to sail you home.
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That was a filler episode, no doubt. I love how TWoP describes the plot as follows: "Sun loses her wedding ring. Better hope Jin doesn't find out! Maybe next week, Jin can attempt to do the laundry -- and turn everything pink!"

:LMAO:

Luckily there are episodes that don't have such crap storylines, and do have naked Desmond. Yay.




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Elian
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Posted: Fri 15 Dec , 2006 7:37 pm
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*E* wrote:
Ditto on the EL nod, but I couldn't disagree more about the rest of the cast. Matthew Fox is one of the best criers ever :P and Josh Holloway is the reason I got into the show. Terry O'Quinn is amazing, same goes for Daniel Dae Kim, Naveen Andrews, Adewale Akinnuoye-Agbaje, Henry Ian Cusick, Elizabeth Mitchell, and Sam Anderson, to name a few. Its a really strong cast. The only Heroes that compare are Masi Oka, Jack Coleman, and Milo Ventimiglia, with Hayden Panettiere, and Leonard Roberts showing some promise.
I find Matthew Fox to be very wooden much of the time, actually. And I'd have included Naveen in my really good actors bit, except they use him so rarely I had literally forgotten about him. Which is another problem I have with Lost, but whatever.

As for Heroes, I'd agree with your list there, except I would add Adrian Pasdar, as I've always liked his work and think he has an usual, but very effective, acting style, and even Ali Larter...I hate her storyline, but she does do a very good job of making her two characters different enough, even in physical ways, that you can tell which she's supposed to be before she starts talking about loving Micah or wanting to kill DL. ;) So that leaves out who...poor old Mohinder. I really think much of his bad acting is due to poor writing, but we'll see in the future.
*E* wrote:
That's not what I said at all. I was responding to those who were because that's who I'm around the most. TWoP, IMDb, LJ, etc... you see how people react to what's popular and how quickly they give up on it.
Well, I can't speak for IMDb or LJ, but I'm on twop a ton, and although there is a great deal of negativity there (as is to be expected really, on a site named television without pity) Lost still has a huge recap readership (one of, if not the largest on twop) and a ton of forum activity...so I don't think it's been 'given up on' there, even if it is bashed routinely by a vocal minority. If people had really given up, it wouldn't be on the site anymore.
*E* wrote:
I can't afford $60 for every show I'm interested in. It's all very tricky.
Noooo no no, that's not what I was suggesting...silly to spend that much money on something you don't know you'll like. Rentals!! I know netflix here in the US offers most tv shows for rental, surely they do in Canada as well?
*E* wrote:
Yeah, last year saw Invasion and Threshold cancelled pretty quickly as well.
And that other one...what was it called? Oh yeah, Surface. That show sucked. Of course, I don't think it's really Lost's fault at all...it's the stupid tv execs who are all, "Oh, they like that freaky sci-fi show, huh? Let's give them way more! That didn't work? Okay, maybe it's the agonizingly slow, mysterious, serialized pace that they like, make more shows like that!" Like seriously, tv people, we don't want to watch 4 of the same show (unless it's CSI or Law and Order, apparently). Make something different already.
*E* wrote:
The similarities between Lost and Heroes I saw were the inter-connecting backgrounds, characters of many different races and cultures, scenes taking place all over the world, both have a wonder kid, a drug-addict, and a couple from Asia. Its more the overall tone and similarities between characters, but yeah. The more I watched it, the more I can separate each show, but Tim Kring is not the most original of writers, which is why I have my eye on it.
Yes, cause diversity, drug addicts, and Asian people are so rare. ;) And can I just say I'm SO glad Niki doesn't wander around screaming "MICAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!!!!!"? ;)

Hopefully Kring will do okay, as he's got plenty of other writers to help him out.
*E* wrote:
EDIT: oh, and two of the more mysterious and potentially dangerous characters (Locke and Mr. Bennet) are both revealed to have worked in a paper company, right? Bennet's job is probably more of a front, but still.
...okay, I'll give you that one. ;) The Office has certainly made paper companies popular on tv...
TWT wrote:
I remember vividly the episode that was all about the Chineese woman's lost wedding ring.
Dude...you watched the show for a year and a half and never noticed that Sun and Jin are, in fact, Korean? :P

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Wilma
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Posted: Sat 16 Dec , 2006 3:59 am
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I wanted to ask is there a way to view the eps from Canada without going through the NBC site? THe clips aren;t availabel from where I live.

I have only ever seen one full episode of Heroes. All the rest I have seen in bits and pieces since I never know when it's on. From what i have seen me likey!!!

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Elian
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Posted: Sat 16 Dec , 2006 4:15 am
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Wilma, I know you can buy them from itunes, but other than that, I'm clueless...it's so annoying that they don't work in Canada from the NBC site! I was trying to get Enchie into it tonight, but no can do because of that...bah. Bad NBC!!!

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