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Sweet Loretta Martin Thought She Was a Woman

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Holbytla
Post subject: Sweet Loretta Martin Thought She Was a Woman
Posted: Wed 03 Dec , 2008 12:32 am
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Well I looked for a Beatles thread but couldn't find one. Either I am horrid at searching (most likely) or no one ever bothered starting one. Hopefully there are a few Beatles fans left and maybe this is something that hasn't been seen before.
Essentially it is a music video of Get Back, but remade with some "lost footage" from the Let It Be film.
It is pretty well done and Beatles fans will enjoy it. Photobucket squished the file size down so it is kind of meh.
I have the original if anyone wants a better copy.

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Post subject: Re: Sweet Loretta Martin Thought She Was a Woman
Posted: Wed 03 Dec , 2008 9:33 am
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Thats fantastic Holby. Where did you find it?

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Holbytla
Post subject: Re: Sweet Loretta Martin Thought She Was a Woman
Posted: Wed 03 Dec , 2008 7:45 pm
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I have a friend that is obsessed with the Beatles and he sent me the link.
He also told me about this one. Pretty funny.

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Post subject: Re: Sweet Loretta Martin Thought She Was a Woman
Posted: Wed 03 Dec , 2008 11:17 pm
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Wow! Everyone talks shit when they're pissed and stoned. You'd like to think Dylan and Lennon together could achieve world peace. But no. ;)

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Holbytla
Post subject: Re: Sweet Loretta Martin Thought She Was a Woman
Posted: Wed 03 Dec , 2008 11:23 pm
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No they were pretty much the run of the mill drunks and wasted asses we all can be. Except they could make music. :)

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Rebecca
Post subject: Re: Sweet Loretta Martin Thought She Was a Woman
Posted: Thu 04 Dec , 2008 5:41 pm
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Thanks for posting those, Holby. :D

(I had to wait till I found headphones since I still don't have speakers. :P )

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TheMary
Post subject: Re: Sweet Loretta Martin Thought She Was a Woman
Posted: Sat 06 Dec , 2008 12:30 am
I took the stars from my eyes, and then I made a map, And knew that somehow I could find my way back; Then I heard your heart beating, you were in the darkness too - So I stayed in the darkness with you
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My parents loved the Beatles and passed that love on to me and I shall pass that love onto my children by educating them when they are young. Baby boomers are old Holby but they aren't dead so there's time to save the younger generations from bad music :D.

My favorite Beatle is of course George, he was such a brilliant song writer :love:. And one the best books I've ever read and I weap because it is out of print and I don't have a copy is "The Last Days of John Lennon" by Frederick Seamen.

Thanks for sharing those videos they were pretty dang cool :)

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Holbytla
Post subject: Re: Sweet Loretta Martin Thought She Was a Woman
Posted: Sat 06 Dec , 2008 12:43 am
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My pleasure. It is good to know people still appreciate them.
I think a few years ago, they were the top selling artist for the year, so people are still listening.

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Jude
Post subject: Re: Sweet Loretta Martin Thought She Was a Woman
Posted: Sat 06 Dec , 2008 1:37 am
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Even I like them! And most of the music I like was written over a hundred years before I was born! :cool:

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Holbytla
Post subject: Re: Sweet Loretta Martin Thought She Was a Woman
Posted: Sat 06 Dec , 2008 7:55 pm
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Wait a minute. Let's back up a bit. Did you just call me old? And I am not a baby boomer. :salmon:

And you directly stole a rank from me that I plagiarized from Christmas Vacation.

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Jude
Post subject: Re: Sweet Loretta Martin Thought She Was a Woman
Posted: Tue 08 Sep , 2009 1:49 pm
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Apparently new remastered versions of The Beatles complete studio recordings are going to be released tomorrow. Writing about the currently-available Beatles CD's an article in the Ottawa Citizen wrote:
Quote:
Those previous Beatle CDs, however, were very much a product of the format's infancy: pretty small and tinny-sounding by today's standards.
So is tomorrow's release going to be so much better that it's worth buying yet another complete set? I'm anxious to find out...

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Post subject: Re: Sweet Loretta Martin Thought She Was a Woman
Posted: Tue 08 Sep , 2009 2:13 pm
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There's a really good thread about this over on HoF. One of the new posters there is a huge Beatles fan and a Sound Engineer. I'll ask if he minds me quoting him over here.

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Axordil
Post subject: Re: Sweet Loretta Martin Thought She Was a Woman
Posted: Wed 09 Sep , 2009 8:25 pm
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I can testify that the remastered stereo mix of "The Beatles" is noticeably better than the 80s version. Better definition overall, but I really heard a difference in things like vocal harmonies, bass lines, brass sections, and drums. That's from a casual first listen-through.

I bought it because I realized I no longer had a copy of the 80s version anyway. I understand "Abbey Road" was also improved to the naked ear, so I will probably buy it too, even though I still have that one. After that I have to think about it. I would love to hear the mono mixes of SPLHCB and Revolver, in particular, but I can't justify the mono box set, even if one were available.

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Jude
Post subject: Re: Sweet Loretta Martin Thought She Was a Woman
Posted: Wed 09 Sep , 2009 10:17 pm
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Were they originally recorded in mono or stereo?

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Axordil
Post subject: Re: Sweet Loretta Martin Thought She Was a Woman
Posted: Wed 09 Sep , 2009 11:47 pm
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The White Album was the last one done mono, but that's kind of misleading. It was also the first one where they had access to 8-track recording, so they both didn't have to bounce down so much, and yet could bounce down more if they wanted to. The transition to stereo was ongoing at that point, so the stereo mix wasn't as much as an afterthought as it had been. There are details in the mono mix missing in the stereo--but it works the other way too this time.

Wow..."Revolution #9" actually sounds...like something. I'm not sure what, but it's not just a muddled mess.

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Jude
Post subject: Re: Sweet Loretta Martin Thought She Was a Woman
Posted: Thu 10 Sep , 2009 1:01 am
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Ugh. It would be a miracle if I actually end up liking Revolution #9. :sick:

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Axordil
Post subject: Re: Sweet Loretta Martin Thought She Was a Woman
Posted: Thu 10 Sep , 2009 1:19 am
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Like would be a strong word. But there's something to listen to now, at least.

On the other hand, there's a separation effect in "Mother Nature's Son" that sent shivers down my spine...the acoustic guitar on the right channel, near the end, sounds like it's panning over to the left--except it's a slightly different acoustic guitar line, one that weaves with the one that stays on the right. Little discoveries like that are fun. :)

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Post subject: Re: Sweet Loretta Martin Thought She Was a Woman
Posted: Thu 10 Sep , 2009 9:53 am
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From Lindred on Hall of Fire, quoted here by permission!
Lindréd wrote:
A bit more about recording the Beatles, and the mono versus stereo issue.

George Martin, Norman Smith (primary engineer for the first six albums), Geoff Emerick (engineer for Revolver, Sgt. Pepper, part of "White Album", and Abbey Road) and the four Beatles themselves never took the stereo mixes very seriously until the last few albums. Through the "White Album" the mono mixes were thought of as the definitive mixes. Stereo mixes were done in much less time, and the Beatles themselves, for at least the first seven albums, were not even present at the stereo mix sessions.

With the early albums, the two-track masters were never really intended to be listened to as they were (backing instrument track hard panned left, vocals and misc. other things hard panned right). They were merely an intermediate step to securing a higher quality mono master (i.e. the vocal/instrument balance could be attended to later, during the making of the mono master, rather than taking up valuable time trying to get it perfect during the actual recording of the songs).

George Martin (regarding the hard panned stereo mixes of the early albums):
Quote:
"People say to me 'it's great to hear John and Paul coming out of one speaker and all the backing out of the other'. I think it's terrible, myself. There's no way I would have agreed to having those records being issued as stereo in that form."
Geoff Emerick:
Quote:
"True Beatles fans would do well to avail themselves of the mono versions of Sgt. Pepper and Revolver because far more time and effort went into those mixes than into the stereo mixes."

(actually, three weeks, versus two and a half days. The Beatles were heavily involved in the Pepper mono mix sessions but did not even bother to go to the stereo mix sessions).

Why? Home "stereo" record players were still rare in the mid sixties. Most people (especially teens) had the simple mono record player units. Later in the sixties adults might have had the one piece furniture style units where the speakers were only a few feet apart. With those types of units in mind, by the time of Rubber Soul George Martin was purposely experimenting with the hard panned stereo mixes to give more separation. But even at this time, and for another three albums or so, the mono mixes were still considered the "real" mixes.

Stereo mixes became the primary (and in most cases only) master mixes after the "White Album".

Couple of other points:
On the two first albums and equivalent singles (recorded on two track recorders), though the idea was to capture a "live" sound (i.e the Beatles playing and singing a song in its entirety), overdubs of some kind (either extra instruments, lead guitar, harmonica, or sometimes vocals) were performed on the majority of the released songs. A fair number of the released songs were also edited together from multiple takes. Only a handful of songs were done completely "live" with no overdubs or edits (eg. "Twist and Shout"), and on a few (for eg. "Love Me Do" and "She Loves You"), an instrumental backing track was recorded first, then vocals were sung "live" while listening to the backing track being played back on monitor speakers. As they were singing, the vocals and pre-recorded backing track would be blended together through the mixing console on to a second two track tape deck. This process was called "superimposition". The decision of whether to do a complete take, including vocals, or to do it in pieces was usually decided by George Martin, depending on the difficulty of the song, and how familiar the band was with it at the time of the recording. In some cases (eg. "Money", I Wanna Be Your Man" and a few others) multiple superimpositions were done, but usually George Martin tried to limit it to one.

After the Beatles started recording with 4-track recorders (at the time of "I Want To Hold You Hand"), they had a bit more flexibility in adding overdubs, but still they always started with getting a good "live" backing track, sometimes with, and sometimes without vocals. When more than four tracks were required they would do "reduction" mixes, combining several tracks from the original 4-track tape onto one track of a second 4-track machine, and then adding more overdubs on the remaining three tracks. Sometimes (especially during Sgt. Pepper) they would do several "reductions". This is how the Beatles recorded until until mid way through the White Album, when they acquired an 8-track recorder.

One other thing: I don't know how many times I've read statements like this online:
"For 500 dollars the average kid with a computer can have a much better recording studio than the Beatles had"

This is simply ludicrous. While it's true that 500 dollars can buy you a basic amateur digital recording program with lots of tracks and multiple "bell and whistle" effects, this does not ensure a great recording. Any professional can tell you that the "front end" of recording is critical. At the time of recording the Beatles EMI studios at Abbey Road had extremely fine (and expensive) microphones, preamps, tape recorders and processing equipment, plus great "spaces", and of course, expert technical personnel. While tape hiss could build up a bit in the analog recording world (especially after multiple superimpositions), it was barely noticeable when handled by experienced pros. Whether it's the Beatles, or, for example, the great performances of Frank Sinatra in the 50s and early 60s, the quality of recordings from that era speak for themselves. There is a LOT to be learned from the warmth, naturalness and character of those recordings. The best studios in the world today spend hundreds of thousands of dollars trying to get hold of equipment that has that terrific vintage sound.

It's interesting to me as a musician/engineer/producer that for those of us who adhere to the "classic" philosphy of recording a band, the basic process hasn't really changed much. We still begin by getting a good live backing track, then add to it with additional "overdub" tracks, fixing/editing as necessary, and adding some effects for "flavor". Granted, with digital technology and many more individual tracks available, the overdubbing and editing process is easier and more surgical, but the approach is still the same.

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Jude
Post subject: Re: Sweet Loretta Martin Thought She Was a Woman
Posted: Fri 11 Sep , 2009 1:13 am
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Tell Lindred thanks for the info!

I see on amazon the stereo box set is $190 and the mono box set is $260! There are individual albums with "2009" listed as the date, but there's nothing in the writeups or reviews that specify that they're the new remastered versions. Not sure I want to dump $260 or even $190 all at once on Beatles music...

One of the reviewers says that the stereo version of the first two albums is almost unlistenable:
Quote:
As noted, the primitive stereo separation cancels out the gains made in the new warmth and detail of the remasters. Listening to these albums on headphone is a headache, and on speakers confusing (vocals in one corner of the room, all instruments way over there). It would've been more sensible to include BOTH the stereo and mono mixes on each disc. With each album clocking in around 35 minutes, there's certainly room.
He has high praise for the rest of the discs, though.

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Axordil
Post subject: Re: Sweet Loretta Martin Thought She Was a Woman
Posted: Fri 11 Sep , 2009 3:20 am
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As Lindred noted, George Marting hated the hard-pan stereo versions too.

Note the stereo CDs are available a la carte, while the mono set is just that, and sold out anyway. For now.

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