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RATIFIED: Article 5: Dispute Resolution

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Do you accept this article as written?
Poll ended at Tue 21 Jun , 2005 12:06 am
Yes.
  
98% [ 58 ]
No.
  
2% [ 1 ]
Total votes: 59
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Primula_Baggins
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Posted: Sun 12 Jun , 2005 7:10 am
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Well, TORN didn't do his part—he went and voted yes.

He's getting soft. . . .

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Wilma
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Posted: Sun 12 Jun , 2005 3:25 pm
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I wanted to ask is there a link to the actual article? I think right now I am only seeing the summary.

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Itoshiki Sensei from Sayonara Zetsubou Sensei. Avatar by: sparklessence

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Voronwë_the_Faithful
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Posted: Sun 12 Jun , 2005 3:34 pm
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Wilma, in the first post there is a link to the full charter text so far. Scroll down until you find Article 5: Dispute Resolution in the Outside Forum . The full text of this article is contained there. :)


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Wilma
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Posted: Sun 12 Jun , 2005 4:25 pm
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Thanks

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Itoshiki Sensei from Sayonara Zetsubou Sensei. Avatar by: sparklessence

"There is no such thing as coincidence in this world, only hitsuzen." - Yuko Ichihara and Kimihiro Watanuki - xxxHolic

"I'm modest, I'll keep my knickers on and die!" - My sister Grace commenting on Bear Gryllis on an episode of Oprah :rofl:

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Wilma
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Posted: Sun 12 Jun , 2005 4:36 pm
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Uh I am reading over the article now and I wanted to ask does there only have to be one mediator when it comes to bikeracks stuff?

I was considering becoming a mediator but I feel I would like someone to confer with. I don't know it may work fine. Also, what if the mediation seems one sided? What if the mediator just says maybe person X should apologize? Maybe it's just that one apology that can fix everything yet person X does not want to give it? Possibly it would seem to them more reasonable if 2 mediators said it rather then one, so that way person X won't feel that the one mediator is being prejudiced, in some way. Yes, I know that both participants in bike racks have to agree on a mediator foirst and that's fine, but they may change their minds once they learn of the decision a mediator has made.

Hope that makes sense.

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Itoshiki Sensei from Sayonara Zetsubou Sensei. Avatar by: sparklessence

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"I'm modest, I'll keep my knickers on and die!" - My sister Grace commenting on Bear Gryllis on an episode of Oprah :rofl:

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Jnyusa
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Posted: Sun 12 Jun , 2005 6:48 pm
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Wilma:

does there only have to be one mediator when it comes to bikeracks stuff?

We decided there should be only one so that it would not appear that the mediators are there to advocate for the different sides of the dispute. They're not supposed to be like lawyers. They're supposed to help all parties find common ground.

I feel I would like someone to confer with. I don't know it may work fine.

There's nothing to stop you from asking someone else for advice, via PM or email for example, but we don't want a thread full of mediators developing a dispute of their own.

Also, what if the mediation seems one sided?

A mediator who is biased isn't likely to be asked to mediate again. I guess if all parties decide that the mediator is doing more harm than good, they can tell the mediator that they just don't need him/her any longer.

What if the mediator just says maybe person X should apologize?

If that's the mediator's honest opinion, they should say so.

yet person X does not want to give it?

This is where peer opinion enters as the most powerful force that we have going for us. We have to give people credit for some smarts. If a mediator really believes that one person should apologize, and knows that isn't going to be received well, then they might try explaining it in private by PM before saying it out loud on the board. If that does't work, then say it out loud in a post. If the person still refused, other posters will not think well of that person. That's really all the influence we have - thinking well of one another.

more reasonable if 2 mediators said it rather then one, so that way person X won't feel that the one mediator is being prejudiced, in some way.

Or they might feel then that 'everyone is against them' or 'the mediators are conspiring behind their backs.' There's no accounting for how people respond in a dispute, but we've decided that our official position will be to let people work this out by themselves. One mediator should be sufficient to give an unemotional assessment of how the problem might be solved.

Jn

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Voronwë_the_Faithful
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Posted: Sun 12 Jun , 2005 7:35 pm
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Wilma, you ask good questions. :) Since I'm the one who pushed the hardest to have a mediation option, and particularly have only one mediator, I wanted to try to supplement Jn's already excellent answer.

It is very rare that people have exactly the same perspective about things. With more then mediator, the disputants are likely to get confusing or even contradictory advice, making it more difficult to come to a resolution rather then easier.

It is rare that a situation will arise that would allow for mediation (as opposed to an actual hearing) in which all the wrong is on one side. It would be the job of the mediator (as I see it) to encourage both sides to see things from the other person's perspective, and to attempt to find common ground, and to encourage a compromise that both sides can live with (even if neither side is completely happy with it). It would be a rare situation indeed in which if I were acting as a mediator I would suggest that one side apologize without the other side doing something in return.

The mediator would never have the power to decide what should happen. At most, she or he can make suggestions. A best case scenario is where the mediator helps the parties themselves mutually decide what the best resolution is.

I hope that makes some degree of sense. :)


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Wilma
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Posted: Sun 12 Jun , 2005 7:56 pm
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Well sure person Y could amend their ways but if peron X refuses to apologize, then what?

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Itoshiki Sensei from Sayonara Zetsubou Sensei. Avatar by: sparklessence

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"I'm modest, I'll keep my knickers on and die!" - My sister Grace commenting on Bear Gryllis on an episode of Oprah :rofl:

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Voronwë_the_Faithful
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Posted: Sun 12 Jun , 2005 8:06 pm
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If both people don't agree on a resolution, there can be no resolution.

If one person's stubbornness gets to the point of actually disrupting the board, its possible there would need to be a hearing. But certainly not because someone refused to apologize. We can not compel people to apologize. It would have to be a situation where someone repeatedly insisted upon posting insulting comments about someone and refused to stop doing so. Something like that.


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Wilma
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Posted: Sun 12 Jun , 2005 8:18 pm
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Hmmm...I sent you a PM. What if in special cases? I can just imagine hurt feelings festering and people either leaving the boards or certain threads. I really want this to be a welcoming place.

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Itoshiki Sensei from Sayonara Zetsubou Sensei. Avatar by: sparklessence

"There is no such thing as coincidence in this world, only hitsuzen." - Yuko Ichihara and Kimihiro Watanuki - xxxHolic

"I'm modest, I'll keep my knickers on and die!" - My sister Grace commenting on Bear Gryllis on an episode of Oprah :rofl:

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*Alandriel*
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Posted: Sun 12 Jun , 2005 8:59 pm
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Only one vote short of a quorum! :cheerleader:

VOTE! :pray:

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Jnyusa
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Posted: Sun 12 Jun , 2005 9:17 pm
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Wilma,

I can just imagine hurt feelings festering and people either leaving the boards or certain threads. I really want this to be a welcoming place.

Yes, this can happen. But the alternative is to give someone moderator powers to make decisions and punish whomever they decide is 'wrong.' We already know that that does not make for a welcoming place.

Wilma, we have to reconcile ourselves to the fact that not everyone in the world is going to get along like bunnies in a hutch. People will leave from time to time because of personal disputes. I don't see any way to avoid that realistically because people are people. :neutral: All we can do is provide a place where problems can be worked out if people want to do that. There's no way to impose happiness on others through mediation or moderation.

Jn

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Voronwë_the_Faithful
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Posted: Sun 12 Jun , 2005 9:40 pm
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Wilma, I've replied to your PM. Other then that, I don't have anything to add to what Jn says above, except to say that if we are going to have a member-moderated board, we are going to have to invest a certain amount of trust in our members. :)


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Wilma
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Posted: Sun 12 Jun , 2005 10:15 pm
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Well I think I will abstain, since I don't think I can vote no.

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Itoshiki Sensei from Sayonara Zetsubou Sensei. Avatar by: sparklessence

"There is no such thing as coincidence in this world, only hitsuzen." - Yuko Ichihara and Kimihiro Watanuki - xxxHolic

"I'm modest, I'll keep my knickers on and die!" - My sister Grace commenting on Bear Gryllis on an episode of Oprah :rofl:

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Primula_Baggins
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Posted: Sun 12 Jun , 2005 10:30 pm
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Wilma, you have every right to vote just as you please. This is a ratification, not a lovefest :) . If you disagree with something and want to say so, then say so. Or vote without saying anything if you would rather.

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Voronwë_the_Faithful
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Posted: Sun 12 Jun , 2005 10:46 pm
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Wilma wrote:
Well I think I will abstain, since I don't think I can vote no.
Wilma, I find this comment extremely puzzling. If you couldn't vote no, would be the point of having a vote in the first place?


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Wilma
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Posted: Sun 12 Jun , 2005 11:09 pm
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Well I voted :)

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Itoshiki Sensei from Sayonara Zetsubou Sensei. Avatar by: sparklessence

"There is no such thing as coincidence in this world, only hitsuzen." - Yuko Ichihara and Kimihiro Watanuki - xxxHolic

"I'm modest, I'll keep my knickers on and die!" - My sister Grace commenting on Bear Gryllis on an episode of Oprah :rofl:

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Eruname
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Posted: Sun 12 Jun , 2005 11:12 pm
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Me too. And was pretty much in time for the quorum on this one! :P

These votes have gone fast. Kudos to the members. :)

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Ara-anna
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Posted: Fri 17 Jun , 2005 2:36 pm
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Yeah I am finally getting to the ones I have already voted on.....

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MaidenOfTheShieldarm
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Posted: Fri 17 Jun , 2005 2:59 pm
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Voted. :blackeye

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