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CHARTER RAT.: Mission Statement - VOTE 'till end Jun 26 GMT

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Do you approve the Mission Statement?
Yes.
  
92% [ 45 ]
No.
  
8% [ 4 ]
Total votes: 49
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Voronwë_the_Faithful
Post subject: CHARTER RAT.: Mission Statement - VOTE 'till end Jun 26 GMT
Posted: Mon 06 Jun , 2005 9:02 pm
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Friends,

We are now opening the discussion and ratification of our Mission Statement. It is given below, and can be read in context here, 1st post: Actual Document

We will discuss from Mon Jun 6 ~9:00pm GMT to Thur Jun 16 ~9:00pm GMT. We will vote from Thur June 16 ~9:00pm GMT to Sun Jun 26 11:59pm GMT. Ratification requires a quorum of at least 39 votes and a super-majority of at least 2/3 of the votes.

The purpose of the discussion is to uncover controversial items and remove them before voting. Please speak freely. Thanks, V.


Mission Statement

Board77 is a democratically governed internet community where members from around the world gather to cultivate friendships and engage in discussion. Our conversations cover any topic of interest to our members, from current events and philosophy to fine arts and the works of J.R.R. Tolkien. We aspire to maintain a culture of respect, equality and openness.

[Note: A very small change in the wording involving moving the word "gather" from before "from around the world" to after that phrase was made in the course of the discussion.]

Last edited by Voronwë_the_Faithful on Sun 26 Jun , 2005 11:27 pm, edited 8 times in total.

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halplm
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Posted: Mon 06 Jun , 2005 9:57 pm
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I'll simply say I object to having ANY mission statement, and for this one in particular, I object to using the term "democratically" and the name "J.R.R. Tolkien."

Neither of those define B77's "mission" if it must have one.

But all of this has been discussed already, so I won't say any more...

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IdylleSeethes
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Posted: Mon 06 Jun , 2005 10:35 pm
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Halplm,

Your statements always have substance and I don't dismiss thim, especially when I disagree. I have noticed your objections to a mission statement and especially one styled in the way of the one created by the committee.

I have not been able to understand your objection. It is customary for an organization to have a mission statement. It is mandatory for a registered corporation to have a stated purpose, and it is normal to use the mission statement.

So, I see no way for us to forgo a statement of purpose, whether we choose to call it a mission statement or not, which makes your first objection moot. Since you have staked your position on the absence of one, I don't think we have had the benefit of hearing from you what words you would choose. It is too late for it to be considered for the mission statement, but I am very curious as to what words you would use for the corporation's statement of purpose.

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Cerin
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Posted: Mon 06 Jun , 2005 10:59 pm
Thanks to Holby
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halplm

Why do you object to 'democratically'? Do you think we are misusing the term. Do you think that doesn't describe the type of governance we've set up? What word do you think would be better?


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halplm
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Posted: Mon 06 Jun , 2005 11:14 pm
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I said this in the other thread, but I don't remember where.

A mission statement is confining. To have a purpose implies a need to accomplish something. We have no such need.

To have "democratically governed" be a purpose, implies that if you don't like the idea of a democratically governed message board, you're not welcome here.

I don't think that's the case. Just because we resolve things democratically, we aren't defined as a board by that. We're defined by our posters.

To include Tolkien in our purpose ties the board irrevocably with Tolkien. Anyone who shows up can see we have a Tolkien forum... that's good enough. We don't have to include it in what DEFINES the board.

If you take those two statements out of the mission statement as written, what it boils down to is:

"We post about what we want, and we respect each other while doing it."

Which was my initial thought, and first post on the subject when I saw there was a "mission statement" being drafted. You can beautify it into what has been written, but that's the gist of it.

It's not a mission statement or statement of purpose, but a statement of what we are. We don't need a purpose, we just need something simple that says what we are or how we got here.

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MaidenOfTheShieldarm
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Posted: Mon 06 Jun , 2005 11:25 pm
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halplm wrote:
We don't need a purpose, we just need something simple that says what we are or how we got here.
Isn't that what the current one is? It doesn't say "We aim to be" or "Our goal is". It just says "Board77 is . . . " That just says who we are. It does say that we aspire to be respectful and whatnot, but that's hardly confining. . .

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Eruname
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Posted: Tue 07 Jun , 2005 12:35 am
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That's a good point Maiden. It is a statement of who we are right now.
Idylle wrote:
It is mandatory for a registered corporation to have a stated purpose,
So if we're looking at becoming a member-owned board through V helping make us a cooperation, we're legally required to have some sort of statement? That's cause enough to vote for this.

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Frelga
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Posted: Tue 07 Jun , 2005 12:49 am
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Quote:
To have "democratically governed" be a purpose, implies that if you don't like the idea of a democratically governed message board, you're not welcome here.
Oh, you are welcome all right. But I think "you" (generic you) may not be as comfortable here as on a privately owned and moderated board. Here, "you" will be asked to volunteer for admin and jury duty, participate in governance polls, and get all upset about a mission statement. Some people may be more comfortable at a board where things are taken care of for them, invisibly. I think it's fair to give a warning.

As for the current version, I think it's good enough, though I liked some of the previous wordings better. If I'm still allowed a minor nitpick, I'd change "where members gather from around the world" to "where members from around the world gather". The "gather from" implies to me a change of physical location.

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TheEllipticalDisillusion
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Posted: Tue 07 Jun , 2005 1:27 am
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Quote:
To have "democratically governed" be a purpose, implies that if you don't like the idea of a democratically governed message board, you're not welcome here.
Bunk. If the sentence continued or had a parenthesis that said: and those who don't like the idea of a democratic board can just leave now, maybe you'd have a point.

The mission statement was one point that I thought should be decided before we opened. A mission statement (or statement of purpose) is not confining, but defining. Who, aside from Torcers, is actually going to spend time at this board if we have no purpose whatsoever? And obviously our purpose need not be anything grand. I think what we have written is fine for a statement of purpose. I don't think I'd add the Tolkien part or even all the different types of things we "could" discuss, just leave it at: Our conversations cover any topic of interest to our members.

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IdylleSeethes
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Posted: Tue 07 Jun , 2005 1:28 am
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Eruname,

These are the sections of an Indiana filing:

Incorporators:
Corporate Purpose(s):
Director Information:
Stock Information:
Bylaws:
Registered agent:


Halplm,

I read your response and then went outside and moved a few yards of mulch. I need you to to the same every evening for the next week.

You avoided answering my question. I hope you wouldn't let me get away with it. I'm waiting for your answer.

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Lidless
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Posted: Tue 07 Jun , 2005 1:55 am
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I said it a couple of times, and I'll say it again - that's not a mission statement - that's a description of what the Board is.
























I mean, what do I know, I'm only a company director.

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TheEllipticalDisillusion
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Posted: Tue 07 Jun , 2005 1:58 am
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I think I might agree with Lidless now.

I'm trying to remember the statement of purpose from the literary magazine I ran in college and see how it compares to this one (in the most basic sense). I'll be back.

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Voronwë_the_Faithful
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Posted: Tue 07 Jun , 2005 2:11 am
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TheLidlessEyes wrote:
I said it a couple of times, and I'll say it again - that's not a mission statement - that's a description of what the Board is.
Which is, of course, exactly what hal said we should have.

I mean, what do I know, I'm only a company director.[/quote]

And we, of course, are a community, not a company, with different needs then a company would have.


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tinwe
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Posted: Tue 07 Jun , 2005 3:10 am
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TheLidlessEyes wrote:
I said it a couple of times, and I'll say it again - that's not a mission statement - that's a description of what the Board is.
I tend to agree with V here - this a community, not a business. When I first read your comments in the other discussion thread my initial response was similar to something that Hal said there - that it would be a lot of pressure. Sure, I would love for this to be “the best community on the internet or in real life”, but I don’t want the burden of that placed on my shoulders. I could care less about “crushing Reebok”, but even if I did I wouldn’t want to be responsible for it. Like Microsoft, I’d love “to enable people and businesses to realize their full potential”, but I’d be terrified to post here if that is what’s expected of me.

I’m very pleased with the proposed statement and I think that the committee has done an excellent job, given the circumstances - namely that it was process by committee. The architecture firm I work for does a lot of church design work, so I’m quite familiar with working with committees (churches just love the damn things). I’ve learned that if you want something bold and exciting you have one of two choices - let one person do it themselves, or hire someone else to do it for you. Design by committee most often leads to something bland and listless which tries to please everyone, but succeeds in inspiring no one.

That said, I think that our committee has done exceedingly well here. The proposed statement is, in my opinion, an accurate reflection of who we are and gives potential members a good idea, at a quick glance, of what we’re about. It doesn’t make unreasonable expectations of us nor does it, in my opinion, confine or restrain us in any way.

I’m very grateful to all of the committee members for their hard work on this and everything else involved in getting us to this point. Thank you. You have my vote.

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Frelga
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Posted: Tue 07 Jun , 2005 3:23 am
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Could the committee Darlings please make it clear just what is up for discussion at this point? Voronwe's first post tells us The purpose of the discussion is to uncover controversial items and remove them before voting. Please speak freely. Of course, with this group anything and everything can be controversial, including prepositions and commas, but does this mean wording can be only trimmed down, not added to or changed? I'd like to understand the scope of permissible input before spending 20 minutes to type up a post where I speak freely. ;)

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Anthriel
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Posted: Tue 07 Jun , 2005 3:38 am
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I nominate Tinwe as my brain. He already says what I'm thinking! :love:

Frelga, I love it when you speak freely. I can't imagine anything you typing being a waste of my time- or anyone else's- to read.

Quote:
with this group anything and everything can be controversial, including prepositions and commas,
for some reason, I read this as:
Quote:
with this group anything and everything can be controversial, including prepositions and llamas,
in which case it would, of course, still be true.

;)


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Jnyusa
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Posted: Tue 07 Jun , 2005 4:11 am
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Frelga,

The original idea behind the discussion period was to pull items that were controversial before voting, so that basically we would be ratifying everything that we agreed upon.

That makes sense on Articles with all those paragraphs and sub-paragraphs :) but it doesn't make a whole lot of sense here because there's only one paragraph.

For my part, I would like to be open to minor semantic improvements, like the one you mentioned ... where friends from around the world gather ... because it does makes more sense ... but I also tremble as I say that because I don't want to be flooded with little tweaks here and there as members try to one-up each other's language skills.

This is Voronwe's thread so I can't put things into the first post, but perhaps I can put that small rearrangement in red here and allow other members to say whether it makes slightly more sense than what we've got. If there's a general concurrence, I don't think the committee should object to a change like that.

However, I will warn in advance again that I will not entertain alternate text versions. Getting this thing to be representative of the members was one hellish job and I'm not going to do it twice.

Members:

Proposal from Frelga: ... where friends from around the world gather ...

If you find this rearrangement of words more accurate, please say so.

Jn

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Primula_Baggins
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Posted: Tue 07 Jun , 2005 4:19 am
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I think Frelga's right—that is better.

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IdylleSeethes
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Posted: Tue 07 Jun , 2005 4:19 am
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Frelga,

I agree, it is a better phrasing. I share Jnyusa's concern about drifting too far. This change preserves all of the original words and the meaning is clearer.


I think I heard Halplm say something about deck chairs.

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Primula_Baggins
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Posted: Tue 07 Jun , 2005 4:21 am
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I, too, share Jn's concern. Coming up with what we have just about burned out the verbal centers of my brain, and I mostly read what other people posted.

If those centers burn out for good, I'll be selling apples on the streetcorners.

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