board77

The Last Homely Site on the Web
It is currently Tue 21 Aug , 2018 2:33 pm

All times are UTC




Post new topic This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 83 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Thu 29 Jan , 2009 1:22 am 
Legendury speller
User avatar

Joined: Mon 14 Mar , 2005 2:06 pm
Posts: 1208
Location: US of A
We need a volunteer from the Jury pool to be the alternate. Anyone want to volunteer?


In addition, the Jury members in private have begun deliberating. As such according to the charter I believe we are supposed to post that the hearing is coming to an end. The hearing remains open for 24 hours after such announcement giving the sauronsfinger the opportunity to add anything he feels appropriate.

_________________
"When people don't believe in you, you have to believe in yourself. "
Pierce Brosnan

"Please don't disillusion me. I haven't had breakfast yet." Card


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu 29 Jan , 2009 1:49 am 
User avatar

Joined: Mon 28 Feb , 2005 9:28 pm
Posts: 4336
Location: The real world
I have presented the information. Thank you.

_________________
There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs. - John Rogers


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri 30 Jan , 2009 1:06 pm 
User avatar

Joined: Thu 24 Feb , 2005 10:34 pm
Posts: 3463
Location: Fall River, MA
RELStuart wrote:
We need a volunteer from the Jury pool to be the alternate. Anyone want to volunteer?


In addition, the Jury members in private have begun deliberating. As such according to the charter I believe we are supposed to post that the hearing is coming to an end. The hearing remains open for 24 hours after such announcement giving the sauronsfinger the opportunity to add anything he feels appropriate.

Sorry we were a bit late. Since the 24 hours has passed, this thread is locked. When you're finished deliberating, please PM the Rangers and one of us will unlock the thread so you can post your decisions.
(Lurker, please PM us if any of what I said is incorrect, as well!)

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue 03 Feb , 2009 5:34 pm 
User avatar

Joined: Thu 24 Feb , 2005 10:34 pm
Posts: 3463
Location: Fall River, MA
I'm unlocking this because the jury has reached their decision. They had 24 hours after notifying sauronsfinger, but sf said it was ok to do now:

sauronsfinger wrote:
We do not have to wait 24 hours. Its all right with me to open it now.

viewtopic.php?p=342513#p342513

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue 03 Feb , 2009 5:39 pm 
Islanded in a Stream of Stars
User avatar

Joined: Wed 27 Oct , 2004 6:24 pm
Posts: 8748
Location: UK
Before any decision is posted I have some questions.

Who called for this hearing? sf says it was him. It seemed like the Rangers had.

The Rangers gave sf a two week ban...from just the symposium or everywhere but the bikeracks? Were the rangers expecting the two week ban to be it or did they want further prosecution to take place in regards to sf?

It seems that there is confusion as to why/how this hearing started and that will affect what the jury is able to decide would it not?

_________________
Abandon this fleeting world
abandon yourself.
Then the moon and flowers
will guide you along the way.

-Ryokan

http://wanderingthroughmiddleearth.blogspot.com/


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue 03 Feb , 2009 5:49 pm 
bioalchemist
User avatar

Joined: Wed 16 Mar , 2005 2:10 am
Posts: 5205
Location: at a safe distance
f wanted one and he was supposed to have one. He was given a two week restriction from the Symposium. He had full posting rights elsewhere, AFAIK. Once the hearing was convened, we threw the whole mess to the jury to decide whether what we'd done was justified and sufficient. As I read the Charter, the jury can do whatever it wants.

_________________
"He attacks. And here I can kill him. But I don't. That's the answer to world peace, people."
-Stickles Shihan


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue 03 Feb , 2009 5:50 pm 
User avatar

Joined: Thu 24 Feb , 2005 10:34 pm
Posts: 3463
Location: Fall River, MA
Erunáme wrote:
Before any decision is posted I have some questions.

Who called for this hearing? sf says it was him. It seemed like the Rangers had.

The Rangers gave sf a two week ban...from just the symposium or everywhere but the bikeracks? Were the rangers expecting the two week ban to be it or did they want further prosecution to take place in regards to sf?

It seems that there is confusion as to why/how this hearing started and that will affect what the jury is able to decide would it not?

Oh, I just posted basically that answer in another thread. So I'll basically copy some of what I wrote there and explain a bit more. :)

Who called for this hearing? sf says it was him. It seemed like the Rangers had.
River, Holby, and I called this hearing. Partly because the Charter said we had to and partly because sf asked for it. I quoted the relevant part of the Charter here.

The Rangers gave sf a two week ban...from just the symposium or everywhere but the bikeracks? Were the rangers expecting the two week ban to be it or did they want further prosecution to take place in regards to sf?
The 2 week ban was just from the Symposium. But we did hope for further action, as I had posted in the opening post. I originally had:
Rebecca wrote:
As it stands now, sauronsfinger has not engaged in any actions that would qualify him for a banning under the current Charter. Therefore, the Rangers are asking the jury to mete out a punishment that is stern enough to deter this behavior from happening again.

But Lurker made me edit it as he felt it was "leading the jury."
He first posted asking me to edit it in hal's hearing thread, which is where I explained that:
Rebecca wrote:
I thought that was the post where we were making our case (sort of, I know there weren't examples) and saying our reasonings. So what if I'm "leading" the jury, since I'm not in any way in charge.... we were presenting our case, our reasonings, and our opinions. But whatever.

I should have written that in sf's hearing thread as well, but I still stand by what I said. We wanted something to deter this behavior and that's why we called the hearing.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue 03 Feb , 2009 5:55 pm 
of Vinyamar
User avatar

Joined: Mon 28 Feb , 2005 4:39 pm
Posts: 7849
Location: Ireland
If SF thought HE was putting us through the process of a hearing, what was his goal? Just to put us all out? To waste our time? Since he fully admitted his guilt, all that was left was sentencing. Did he really want us to spend time in a farcical hearing to sentence him to time already served?

Thats it. I am done with this. Our verdict was fair.

_________________
Image
These are my friends, see how they glisten...


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue 03 Feb , 2009 6:10 pm 
User avatar

Joined: Mon 28 Feb , 2005 9:28 pm
Posts: 4336
Location: The real world
I wrote this on page one of this thread

It seems that if I do NOT ask for a hearing - then my punishment is fixed at the two week Symposium ban and then I come back with full rights. But if I ask for a hearing, and it is held, my punishment could be more "STERN". That seems like a severe violation to the very idea of due process and is held as a club to discourage people from asking for a hearing.

I hope I am being paranoid and am reading that completely wrong. Could you please clarify this question of mine before we proceed?

thank you.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue 03 Feb , 2009 6:12 pm 
The Grey Amaretto as Supermega-awesome Proud Heretic Girl
User avatar

Joined: Thu 24 Feb , 2005 3:46 pm
Posts: 19847
I also think our verdict was fair. I thought we were doing the job we were supposed to be doing. While this may be sf's first hearing, this is most definitely not his first offense, and that had bearing on our decision.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue 03 Feb , 2009 6:15 pm 
User avatar

Joined: Mon 28 Feb , 2005 9:28 pm
Posts: 4336
Location: The real world
if I appeal, to whom am I appealing?

And I am no idiot. I know darn well that people are fed up and want this to finish. I know that. But I was told by the Loremaster of my hearing that two weeks was the maximum punishment I could get.

here it is

From what I read it is up to the jury to decide whether to impose the temp suspension or to lessen the suspension just as long it doesn't exceed the two weeks already imposed. Or "If this is a first offense and the Jury feels that the time already restricted to the Bike Racks or the Jury Room is sufficient, or if they feel confident that because of the circumstances in which the error took place it is very unlikely to be repeated, they are not obligated to impose a penalty."


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue 03 Feb , 2009 6:21 pm 
User avatar

Joined: Thu 24 Feb , 2005 10:34 pm
Posts: 3463
Location: Fall River, MA
Since sf said he didn't mind, would one of the jury members please post the verdict? Just so we aren't confusing everyone while discussing this. Thanks. :)

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue 03 Feb , 2009 6:37 pm 
User avatar

Joined: Mon 28 Feb , 2005 9:28 pm
Posts: 4336
Location: The real world
Alatar ..... actually I was trying to avoid the whole idea of my requested hearing by asking those important questions, not once but twice. right up front. If I had been told I was placing myself in increased jeapordy, I would have called it off because the most I had to gain was a few days either way.

As far as putting the jurors through anything, I tried to do this as fast and politely as possible. If you compare my conduct through the hearing, with the other jury and what they are facing, I think you will see I tried to make this as painless as possible.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue 03 Feb , 2009 6:37 pm 
bioalchemist
User avatar

Joined: Wed 16 Mar , 2005 2:10 am
Posts: 5205
Location: at a safe distance
sf, you do realize that the Rangers had no idea what was going to happen once the Hearing was convened right?

_________________
"He attacks. And here I can kill him. But I don't. That's the answer to world peace, people."
-Stickles Shihan


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue 03 Feb , 2009 6:40 pm 
User avatar

Joined: Wed 16 Mar , 2005 10:42 pm
Posts: 571
Location: Body in Calgary, Alberta, Soul in Toronto
A jury member who voted againts this decision can also post their "minority report" after the verdict has been posted. Thanks.

_________________
Caution...You are entering the NO SPIN ZONE.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue 03 Feb , 2009 6:53 pm 
User avatar

Joined: Wed 16 Mar , 2005 10:42 pm
Posts: 571
Location: Body in Calgary, Alberta, Soul in Toronto
sauronsfinger wrote:
if I appeal, to whom am I appealing?

And I am no idiot. I know darn well that people are fed up and want this to finish. I know that. But I was told by the Loremaster of my hearing that two weeks was the maximum punishment I could get.

here it is

From what I read it is up to the jury to decide whether to impose the temp suspension or to lessen the suspension just as long it doesn't exceed the two weeks already imposed. Or "If this is a first offense and the Jury feels that the time already restricted to the Bike Racks or the Jury Room is sufficient, or if they feel confident that because of the circumstances in which the error took place it is very unlikely to be repeated, they are not obligated to impose a penalty."


As I have stated in my PM, I have to admit that I ommitted a crucial part in the "Guidelines for Penalties" thus I had to go back and edit my post since it is my understanding that the jury has also read the same set of rules. If this crucial piece of information has caused you to agree on this hearing, I will present it as evidence to the appeals board. I have no power to reverse the verdict.

_________________
Caution...You are entering the NO SPIN ZONE.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue 03 Feb , 2009 7:06 pm 
User avatar

Joined: Mon 28 Feb , 2005 9:28 pm
Posts: 4336
Location: The real world
Thank you Lurker for that post. It means a gtreat deal to me. And yes, if I appeal, I would appreciate you being involved in that.

Let me ask again, if I appleal, to whom am I appealing? The charter says the four previous Rangers --- so just who is that?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue 03 Feb , 2009 7:15 pm 
bioalchemist
User avatar

Joined: Wed 16 Mar , 2005 2:10 am
Posts: 5205
Location: at a safe distance
Jude
LalaithUrwen
Crucifer
elfshadow
Elian

Pick.

_________________
"He attacks. And here I can kill him. But I don't. That's the answer to world peace, people."
-Stickles Shihan


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue 03 Feb , 2009 7:24 pm 
User avatar

Joined: Wed 16 Mar , 2005 10:42 pm
Posts: 571
Location: Body in Calgary, Alberta, Soul in Toronto
LalaithUrwen and Elfshadow are jurors in this hearing so they are out. Jude is a juror in Hal's hearing I don't know if this will be a conflict of interest in his appeal.

Anybody else in the former Ranger list?

_________________
Caution...You are entering the NO SPIN ZONE.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue 03 Feb , 2009 7:30 pm 
bioalchemist
User avatar

Joined: Wed 16 Mar , 2005 2:10 am
Posts: 5205
Location: at a safe distance
From the next term back:
The Watcher
Leoba
Estel
Nin
Ara-Anna

_________________
"He attacks. And here I can kill him. But I don't. That's the answer to world peace, people."
-Stickles Shihan


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 83 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next

All times are UTC


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group