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Fun with Anthropology! ONCE MORE WITH FEELING.

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MaidenOfTheShieldarm
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Posted: Sat 09 Dec , 2006 4:20 am
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It's done and handed in. Thank goodness.

Thank you so, so much to those who took time the time to talk to me and answer my (probably sometimes inane) questions. I really enjoyed doing this project, much more than I thought I would, and it was mostly because the conversations I got to have were so interesting.

Thank you also to all those who offered to be interviewed at all. I appreciate it and wish that I'd had the time to talk to all of you. I was planning on it, but as it was I barely had time to write my paper at all. ;)

I wish I could offer everyone real cookies of gratitude, but a) I don't know how to post cookies and b) right now, my cooking repetoire is limited to pasta, easy mac, tea, and bad stirfry, so here are e-cookies of gratitude instead.

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Elian
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Posted: Sat 09 Dec , 2006 5:16 am
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I have the sudden urge to bake sugar cookies.....:P


Also, is it wrong if I kinda want to read the thing now? ;) lol

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LalaithUrwen
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Posted: Sat 09 Dec , 2006 6:08 am
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:love: Thanks for the e-cookies!

The interview was fun!

(Yeah, I'm interested in reading the paper, too. Are you brave enough to share it with us?)


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TheMary
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Posted: Sat 09 Dec , 2006 7:14 am
I took the stars from my eyes, and then I made a map, And knew that somehow I could find my way back; Then I heard your heart beating, you were in the darkness too - So I stayed in the darkness with you
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I rather enjoyed our little gossip session! I too am jumping on the "wanna read if you'll share" the paper bandwagon.

I'm glad you got it finished :hug:

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Estel
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Posted: Sat 09 Dec , 2006 11:11 am
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I know we chatted briefly last week, but how can your piece be considered authoritative without having interviewed me or that spammer Prim?



Edit - this is a post by Steve again

Last edited by Estel on Sun 10 Dec , 2006 12:38 am, edited 1 time in total.

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ToshoftheWuffingas
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Posted: Sat 09 Dec , 2006 12:54 pm
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Anthropology? The study of Anthriel is a huge undertaking, once begun, never finished. Very rewarding though.

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Lidless
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Posted: Sun 10 Dec , 2006 1:28 pm
Als u het leven te ernstig neemt, mist u de betekenis.
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Having seen the pic of Anthy, that's a subject I'd like to get into in depth. Know the ins and outs of, as it were.

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elfshadow
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Posted: Sun 10 Dec , 2006 5:09 pm
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We wants to see the finished product too, preciousss! I had lots of fun talking with you on the phone, even if I was sick and sounded like I had emphysema. I normally sound much better than that. And hopefully you enjoyed my noncontinuous rambling. Congrats on finishing! :cheers:


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MaidenOfTheShieldarm
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Posted: Sun 10 Dec , 2006 6:52 pm
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[quote=""Estel""]I know we chatted briefly last week, but how can your piece be considered authoritative without having interviewed me or that spammer Prim?[/quote]

It's not authoritative at all. In fact, it's really not good at all.

I will post it at some point (probably next week, so I can make sure it's fit to be read anyone other than me) for those of you who are curious, though most of what I wrote is pretty darn obvious.

Thank you all again! I owe you all and am ever so much obliged.

And now, on to the next paper! :horse:

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MaidenOfTheShieldarm
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Posted: Wed 18 Apr , 2007 5:23 am
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Someone brought this up again and there were a few requests to read it, so here's the final paper that I wrote. It's very Captain Obvious -- nothing you all probably don't know already, but here it is. Please don't shun me after you finish.

‘RL’ and the Intrawebs

It is a commonly stated belief that the internet is the downfall of communication. No one writes letters anymore. Important conversations often end up written in netspeak in cyberspace. It’s all very impersonal. This evaluation completely forgets about another development of the internet: online communities. In the past, people would gather to raise barns, make quilts, ando other such things. Now people sit by themselves in front of a computer for many ‘gatherings,’ instead. This is world of the internet, where communication consists of posts in threads, long conversations over instant messenger, and making faces at each other over web cameras to get even a little of that face to face feel.

My study focused specifically on a group of three interconnected messageboards. The primary subject was a board called Board77.net (B77). The other two were theonering.com (TORC) and the thehalloffire.net (HoF). TORC is, as may be guessed by the name, primarily a Tolkien site. It was started in 1999 to discuss the books and upcoming movies, but expanded to include general socializing, political and religious debates, and a writing group. Each of these fora had a very different atmosphere and specific core group of posters. Unhappy with some of the administrative decisions, a group of 20 created Board77 to discuss a petition they were writing. It soon became more than just business, and select people from TORC were invited to join the fun. At one point, after many behind the scenes arguments and events, the original B77ers clashed with the administrators on TORC and twenty people were banned for no apparent reason, all of them B77 members. B77 and TORC parted ways, with anger on both sides. More people were invited to B77. It was a closed board – that is, all prospective members were voted on by the existing membership. I was issued an invitation a few days after the banning episode, in March 2005. The plan was to create a completely democratic board with a rotating system of administrators (admins) to ensure that what happened to TORC never happened again, with the ultimate goal being the opening the board to the internet public. A vast and intricate charter was written with rules to cover every conceivable scenario. Eventually, after this document was finished, B77 flung open its doors and there was a great influx of people, mostly TORCers who had wanted to join but were locked out when invitations stopped or who were curious about this mysterious place. They say that history repeats itself, and it seemed to be the case here. After a series of small clashes, a huge fight broke out between a few posters that ended up catching up the entire board in its wake. Many people felt hurt and disillusioned. Quite a few of these left altogether. A few months later, yet another board was started up by the two people most involved in the writing of the Charter: The Hall of Fire. It was intended to be a more serious, decorous board with a focus on the subject that originally brought everyone together: Tolkien and his works. Now, almost exactly one year later, there is still bitterness floating around about these events.

In this study, I was interested in studying the dynamics among these boards: how it differs from ‘real life’ interaction, the social politics, the relationships. My real questions, however, ended up being about how internet relationships differed from ones that take place in person (“real life”). To this end, I conducted six interviews. Two of these took place over the phone (Informants A and E). The other four were conducted over instant message. This had two reasons: first, since writing is how most relationships are conducted online, it seemed appropriate to stick with this medium. Second, informants seemed to open up and talk both more deeply and more candidly over IM. This allowed for a more fluid conversation than the strict question and answer format that ended up being followed over the phone. Additionally, I have unwittingly been doing participant observation ever since I first joined TORC way back in April 2004.

My initial interest was the dynamics and politics between these three boards, Board77, TORC, and the Hall of Fire and to learn more about the deep divisions that still exist between these related communities. Each has a very different poster base and demographics. TORC, for instance, used to have a very wide range of ages and backgrounds. It was this diversity that drew and kept many people. It’s very unusual in real life to find a nineteen year old hanging out with someone in their fifties, but on TORC it was more than common. B77 was later made up of people who used to post in the two most intense fora there, and thus ended up with a concentration of intelligence and passion that had been diluted by the huge membership of TORC. These same people, the original B77ers, migrated at least in part to HoF when it was created. In general, HoF was on a much more even keel. The contrasts are very telling about the dynamics between and within them.

These differences had not so much to do with the posters themselves as with the circumstance of creation. TORC was started by deeply devout Christians who wanted a very family friendly board that led to many of the older members feeling very restricted and condescended to. Board77 became what it was in the midst of a combination of overwhelming anger and idealism. Anger at the TORC admins for the events that precipitated the break between the two left most B77ers with a great distrust of any sort of hierarchy or authority. Everything had to be strictly democratic with not so much as a hint of anyone having more power than someone else. Discussions were long and complex and often settled very little. Although it was generally civil, once some more important and loaded topics came up, tempers tended to flare. Positions were taken and not given up for anything, because there was never anyone to step in and arbitrate. This attitude still reigns on B77, despite the fact that one of aforesaid arguments ended up almost killing the entire board, as it is termed. After this, HoF was created. This created yet another tempest, with posters who had not been informed or involved feeling betrayed or insulted. That was a year ago, and many are still very bitter, both because of the split itself and because of the implication that B77ers weren’t sophisticated or deep enough. Many also distrusted the hierarchy that was put in place.

Although still interested in the subject, through various conversations my focus ended up being more on what makes up the culture of online communication and why it differs so much from real life interaction. It is not just the lack of face to face interaction. It has its own language and customs, referred to as ‘netiquette,’ completely separate from the culture that a poster may belong to in their offline life. Like any other subculture, those who populate the internet have their own lingo – words like ‘intrawebs’ for the internet, mods and admins for those in the hierarchical structure, and m00t for a real life meeting. Interactions and relationships work differently than they would if the same thing happened in real life.

The internet provides a very unique form of communication in that it is purely written. The indicators that give meaning in normal conversation simply are not there: body language, expression, and gesture are non-existent and tone of voice and inflection are left entirely to the imagination of the reader. This, I think, accounts for a great deal of the dynamics of online communities. As informant E so succinctly put it, “Messageboards allow you to see inside people a lot sooner than in normal real life.” If you don’t like what you see, problems arise more quickly and more dramatically. Besides the aforementioned indicators, other things are missing online that we take for granted in real life: things like race, gender, age, and even name are unknowns unless the poster chooses to reveal them. All there is, is words. They say first impressions are the most important, and because the normal things we make snap judgments on are based on a person’s words – that is, on their mind and their thinking. On the one hand, this can be very nice because you don’t get people little tics and habits that might get annoying if you were talking face to face. On the other hand, it makes many interactions more intense than they would be in real life. With no subtle tone or small smile, it can be easy to take offense at the slightest thing that was meant to be nothing but friendly. The fact that you cannot see anyone and are, while composing a post, simply writing down your thoughts, makes it much easier to lose control. As informant C commented, “It’s also harder to laugh stuff off when it sits there for everyone else in the whole world to read.”

The dynamic that facelessness creates works the other way, too Many have commented, and I find this to be true, that they find it easier to reveal and discuss very personal things online. Because you cannot see the people whom you are telling, it is like they aren’t there. Western society is highly individualist – admitting problems can be seen almost as a weakness. By admitting it online, however, it is possible to pretend that you are typing it out for yourself. The others aren’t real. Informant A said that “If you’re talking to someone in real life, if feels like they’re judging you. If it’s a complete stranger, there’s less judging.” It can be awkward to have people that you see everyday or even live with know intimate and potentially embarrassing things about yourself and your thoughts. Many of the people that I know online know far more about me than anyone that I interact with daily here in ‘real life.’ Informant D also said that it’s easier because you can compose what you’re saying and think about word choice and order, instead of the more stream-of-consciousness way that actual conversation generally tends toward. This lends a feeling of confidence, because you know that what you are you saying is, in fact, exactly what you want to say. Similar to this, some informants said that they had a different persona online. When it is only your words that represent you, it is easier to create the person you want to project. This feeling that the person who is telling about personal things is not entirely you may almost make it easier.

Thus, internet relationships can be both deeper and not as real as face to face ones. You get to know someone’s mind without having the obstacle of preconceived notions based on unconscious biases. It’s much more of an even playing field. On the other hand, because of the mode of communication, you don’t get to know the odd habits and facts that people more unique, such as what someone’s favourite sweatshirt is or how they twitch their face when they’re uncomfortable.

Another somewhat unique aspect of internet communities is that they are entirely self-selecting. No one is forced to be there: you are there if you want to be. The people who select themselves, especially in a group that started out with a focus on Tolkien, is obviously going to be skewed and not representative of the broader population. This particularly shows in the ratio of introverts to extroverts. The overwhelming majority of posters are introverts – in an informal poll, only eight people out of 86 identified themselves as extroverts. Informant E said that most were also “socially unsuccessful,” and that because of this they tended to look more for relationships online. He attributed to this the fact that almost everyone feels deeply insecure, no matter how well loved they may actually be, saying that this feeling of social awkwardness sticks with you, no matter what. Someone (generally very popular) recently started a discussion which she entitled “I’m actually not that stupid.” In her opening post, she said that she often felt very stupid and wasn’t sure why that was. A surprising number of people, who are also very intelligent, said they also felt very insecure and like they didn’t belong, even though they intellectually knew that that wasn’t necessarily the case. Many attributed this to another very strange aspect of internet communication – it isn’t exactly a conversation.

The way messageboard discussions work is that someone starts a topic, called a thread. People then respond to it if they have something to say. Because people post their own thoughts individually (i.e., not in the context of a group conversation) and when they have time, it doesn’t follow a strict conversational format. Some posts will not be responded to at all while others will spawn pages of discussion. There is no guarantee of response. Thus, people feel ignored and left out, even if it is really only a case of there being nothing more to say or not knowing how to respond properly. This can lead to more than just self-esteem issues. Informant E said that “A lot of the drama tends to come from a feeling of personal insecurity.” There is a tendency post ‘louder’ to make sure that they are heard. A calm, logical post can be ignored, whereas an angrier or more passionate one has a greater chance of being responded to. This is no different than in real life, of course. More emotion leads to a more emotional response. It escalates the need to defend one’s position, as well. It is easier to let go of an idea or opinion when it is not being attacked. Instead of being reasonable, one is more inclined to be defensive, regardless of whether or not that makes sense. The peak of the conflicts on B77 was just such a case: it started out with the discussion being fairly civil, until someone took off their gloves. Then many started to get defensive and any rationality was either left behind or ignored. The fact that it was online and not a real time argument exacerbated this further, because it was able to go on for days, non-stop. Again, this works out well for friendly interactions, as it allows for a much greater depth of discussion than in real life. The irrelevance of time is a factor, as is the fact that it is written. When you don’t have to make up your side of the conversation as you go along, you can really think about and compose what you want to say, pulling from sources, making careful choices, and figuring out exactly how to get your point across. This is yet another reason that online interactions can be deeper than real life ones.

The internet is the main place of meeting up, but that is not to say that people never meet. Gatherings called ‘m00ts’ regularly take place, with sometimes as many as 40. People go great distances for these, like going to a family reunion. For instance, this past September, I went to such a m00t in San Francisco to meet 30 people from B77 and HoF. As almost all of my informants commented, m00ts make the internet interactions real – suddenly the people you’ve known intimately for years have voices and expressions. It’s a very small sort of culture shock, going from writing to face to face interaction. This serves to highlight the differences between online culture and real life culture.

A lot of these differences between online and off can be summed up by one interesting term that is very commonly used. As I mentioned earlier, offline is referred to as ‘real life.’ This is a very telling term about how we view the world of the internet. By designating our day to day, offline life as ‘real,’ it seems to have the implication that online is not real. The people are not entirely real, so it is easier both to get very angry and to reveal very personal things. Although messageboards are not the typical community, it is still a very real culture, with its own traditions, customs, and terminology.

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LalaithUrwen
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Posted: Wed 18 Apr , 2007 2:50 pm
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:clap:

Sounds very good to me!

Nice job putting it all together. :)


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yovargas
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Posted: Wed 18 Apr , 2007 2:51 pm
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Shuns the disbelilever.



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MaidenOfTheShieldarm
Post subject: Re: Fun with Anthropology! ONCE MORE WITH FEELING.
Posted: Mon 27 Apr , 2009 8:23 pm
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Remember how much fun anthropology is?

WELL. I'm doing another ethnography! Try to contain your excitement. This time my topic is feminism and misogyny within fandom and I need people who are actively involved in fandom to interview. Because I just found out my paper is actually due on Wednesday. Um, yay? I'll make you cookies. :pray:

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Ara-anna
Post subject: Re: Fun with Anthropology! ONCE MORE WITH FEELING.
Posted: Mon 27 Apr , 2009 8:54 pm
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Would that be us?

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Wilma
Post subject: Re: Fun with Anthropology! ONCE MORE WITH FEELING.
Posted: Mon 27 Apr , 2009 9:53 pm
Takoyaki is love
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Hey, I am willing to help. I am involved in a couple of fandoms, and all of us were involved in one fandom, which is how we all got here.
I have a phone card so pm a time that is good for you. I am free tonight after 6.

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Pippin4242
Post subject: Re: Fun with Anthropology! ONCE MORE WITH FEELING.
Posted: Mon 27 Apr , 2009 10:53 pm
Hasta la victoria, siempre
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Mossy, I've got a lot to say about misogyny in fandom. Huge bee in my bonnet, to be honest. If you want to get me tonight, I'll be up for a couple of hours yet. :)

-Pips-

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MaidenOfTheShieldarm
Post subject: Re: Fun with Anthropology! ONCE MORE WITH FEELING.
Posted: Tue 28 Apr , 2009 5:27 am
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Verily, Ara-anna.

Pips and Wilma: a) :love: b) PMs!

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