board77

I want to ask those of you out there that have a Mac at home since I'm very seriously considering scrapping this lousy PC of mine and switching. I'm soo sick and tired of Windows updates that then end up half-crashing my computer... and I'm not even saying anything about viruses and worms

.. and then there is of course the 'Angst'

... what about my old files? Word docs and such... can I still use them? And if so how? What programs will I need to 'convert' stuff?

.. what about IM? Emails to non-Mac users etc.?

What are your experiences sharing files with non-Mac users?

Any other major pro's and/or con's please let me know. Thanks
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Resident witchâ„¢

I have never owned a Mac, but as a computer tech I know a lot of those answers anyway.

Most of your document files can be read regardless of platform. DOC files are pretty much standardized and can be read regardless of machine. A few proprietary file types might require software that can only be loaded on a PC, but most Macs have emulators for such software.

Every predominant IM software package I know of has a Mac equivalent, so from your end nothing should change. Most IM programs have server-based lists that don't require your machine to hold much. Just put all your settings how you want them again.

File-sharing should be unaffected if you can find a Mac-compatible program or run them in an emulator.

Now, that being said...

Viruses do exist for Mac platforms (not as many for PCs, but a lot and some are cross-platform), and they are not any easier to get rid of than PC viruses. A lot of tech people will tell you 'its your own fault for owning a Mac' and let you fix it yourself because they don't know how to and won't admit it for pride. You will have a hard time getting unofficial tech support because so few technicians work on Macs.

They are not easy to upgrade hardware-wise. This may or may not be an issue for you. They are also a bitch to work on, hardware-wise, if something goes wrong because nearly all their parts are proprietary to Apple and they charge arms, legs, and first-born children.

Macs are generally superior to PCs in graphics design and display, but not as effective at number-crunching. If you are a non-power user you wouldn't notice a difference.

I would be inclined to pick up a cheap new PC. I recently bought a bottom end Dell for my mother and I was stunned at the low price.

It was an Intel 3.2GHz with 512MB Ram, a CD Writer/DVD Reader Combo, an 80GB HD, USB Mouse and KB and 17" CRT Monitor. Oh, and speakers. It worked out at €410 including VAT and Shipping.

For that price you wouldn't even get a Mac Mini and then you'd still have to buy Monitor KB and Mouse.

Cheers,
Alatar

I've owned Macs for 21 years and been online since the BB days. Right now we are running three networked Macs online every day.

We have never had a single virus. We have never had spyware.

OS X doesn't crash (I mean it does not). I've had Word crash a few times, but it doesn't bring the system down—you simply start up Word again.

As for repairs, of the 12 Macs we've owned since 1984, the only one that ever needed repair was an ancient Powerbook 100 I bought used. My husband is using an iMac that's been in continuous use for more than 5 years (literally continuous, as we run SETI at Home on it all night), and has never had a problem.

They are good computers, easy to use, and free of headaches. The iMacs and eMacs are excellent buys for what you get. Clock speed isn't directly comparable to PC clock speeds—Mac clock speeds are slower for comparable performance.

Needless to say I really recommend them. I've watched my parents struggle with PCs for years, and have used them myself for work, and it just doesn't compare.

We bought our newest Mac about two weeks ago, and needed to transfer all three kids' files and preferences from the old one to the new one. We started the old one while pressing one key so it started up as a "hard drive," connected the two with Firewire cable, and turned on the new computer. It asked us, "Do you have an old Mac you want to transfer data from?" We clicked "Yes" and in a few minutes 60 GB had been moved over onto the new computer—the kids' preferences, desktops, files, applications, games, everything—without us having to do a thing. The new one starts up identically to the old one, and everything is there where they left it.

That's how they're designed. I like it.

I have a bias since I make a living developing on Microsoft platforms. I expect to be running a Vista beta shortly.

I worked in Unix for 15 years, so I have a lot of respect for it.

Advantages of a Mac

- No matter what it's called, it runs Unix which is very stable, unlike Windows

- Better commercial graphics

- Great install method vs Windows

- In less than 5 years, the Mac OS will be running on PCs. This is Apple's real future, which it loudly disclaims. Apple is moving to Intel processors soon and the rest is just logical.

Disadvantages of a Mac

- Cost/performance is abysmal

- Minor incompatiblity problems that turn into major headaches if you exchange files with PC users


I still think there is a better than 50/50 chance that Microsoft will win the coming battle and Apple will remain a niche product. However, Apple will grow dramatically even if it loses. Microsoft has the assets to do whatever needs to be done to win, just not the foresight to do it.

If it were me, I would buy one last PC running Windows and hope that my next PC would be running an Apple OS. It will also save you money, but cost you frustration. If you by a PC make sure you protect it with a hardware firewall, AVG and AdAware.

My son, who does web page development, just bought one of each to hedge his bet.

When my PC dies, I'm getting a Mac.

That's about as far as my expert advice goes though.


I was brought up on Macs; we got an LC when I was 11, and as my parents upgraded, the old computers were passed down. That LC got me all the way through university and survived many trips over a hilly campus in a shopping trolley. Never a problem (except a need for a new monitor, after one two many shopping trolley incidents).

My Mum still uses Macs, whilst my Dad has a PC. It's his computer that's been laid up in non-working agony for the best part of a year.

And they are so user friendly.

I heard someone on radio once characterise the Mac voice as 'Hey dude, come and see how we hang out.' whereas MS was 'You miserable Earthling. You will never defeat us.'

Quote:

Cost/performance is abysmal

I'm afraid that's the breaker for me right now. Had a long look in the Apple shop on Regent Street and walked out sighing. I need to feed the piggy bank in a major way before I can attempt to get the system that I need (almost triple the price than a PC )

Quote:

..In less than 5 years, the Mac OS will be running on PCs.

That is good news then - I just have to put my patience-o-meter up a wee bit.

Alatar: €410 is a fantastic price for the specs you quoted. Dell UK seems to have higher prices (but then I guess they change almost on a daily basis). Was that system brand-new or one of the 're-furbished' ones?

.... one day, it will be a Mac that's for sure Thanks for all your input folks! Much appreciated

The trick is knowing where to go one their web page and how to minimize the cost. I just tried the method I use on the UK Website and it works the same.

Go to www.dell.co.uk/special then click on desktops. They usually have a "Handpicked Desktops" section at the bottom. Today it's as follows:

DimensionTM 3000
Intel® Celeron® D Processor 330 (2.66GHz, 533FSB, 256KB cache)
Microsoft® Windows® XP Home Edition
17" CRT Colour Monitor (15.9" v.i.s0.28 dot pitch)
40GB Hard Drive (7200 RPM)
48x CD-RW/DVD Combo Drive
Now 512MB Memory (Was 256MB)
FREE DELL 720 COLOUR PRINTER!
£349

As you can see, that's with free double memory and a printer. You'll find that when you go to order that the price goes up. This is because they add in 3 Year Warranty. Cancel it and go with the 90 day Return to Shop version.

Cheers,
Alatar

you have a point. But you know what? When I click on your link above I get http://adfarm.mediaplex.com/ad/ck/2397-19979-8602-5 instead. Now is that weird or what??

You're right though that navigation is a pain. I check links to 'as seen on TV' and any other featured specials.. but it's really a royal pain in the backside. Too bad that Tiny/Time computers went out of business. I got this computer from them, an excellent deal and also good support. I'm not that enthusiastic about Dell to tell you the truth.

That's the page Alandriel. Click on the "Desktops" under "Browse our products". It will bring you to the page with the Handpicked Desktop on the Bottom Left.

I worked for Dell in Ireland for 3 years and I can honestly say the build quality is excellent. Quality Control and Soaktesting are very thorough and they use all name brands in their chipsets.

I couldn't build a PC using no-name brands for as little as Dell charge for their low end systems.


Alatar

Alandriel wrote:

you have a point. But you know what? When I click on your link above I get http://adfarm.mediaplex.com/ad/ck/2397-19979-8602-5 instead. Now is that weird or what??

That happened to me once when I clicked on a thread link here, trying to pull up a thread. I was all, WTF? I hit back and clicked again and it worked fine. I fear there may be a new bug going around that hasn't been identified yet.

I'm oogling now an Apple IBook G4, 1.42GHz, 1GB RAM, HD 60GB with a DVD/CD RW, Bluetooth and MacOS 10.4

sighhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

If I'm lucky I can add it into the books of a new company

But I want to get back to something that

Fixer wrote:

Viruses do exist for Mac platforms (not as many for PCs, but a lot and some are cross-platform), and they are not any easier to get rid of than PC viruses. A lot of tech people will tell you 'its your own fault for owning a Mac' and let you fix it yourself because they don't know how to and won't admit it for pride. You will have a hard time getting unofficial tech support because so few technicians work on Macs.

Just how bad is this really? Is there virus protection software also for Mac? I always thought McAffee or Norton only existed for PC but maybe there is a version (or something from a different company) for Apple?

Alandriel, I decided it would be easiest to ask my Mum to answer your security questions, given she's been glued to Macs for the past 14 years.


I sent her this bit of your post:

Alandriel wrote:

But I want to get back to something that

Fixer wrote:

Viruses do exist for Mac platforms (not as many for PCs, but a lot and some are cross-platform), and they are not any easier to get rid of than PC viruses. A lot of tech people will tell you 'its your own fault for owning a Mac' and let you fix it yourself because they don't know how to and won't admit it for pride. You will have a hard time getting unofficial tech support because so few technicians work on Macs.

Just how bad is this really? Is there virus protection software also for Mac? I always thought McAffee or Norton only existed for PC but maybe there is a version (or something from a different company) for Apple?

Leoba's Mum wrote:

Looks like advice from a PC user!

Yes there are mac viruses but in 14 years I've never come across one - and using Safari, which comes with the system, as an internet browser makes it even safer. You can use Firefox on a Mac too. Norton make a full Mac package of their Utility programme, Systemworks and full antivirus and firewall software and there is additional firewall software built into the system now. I have it on my computers and run an automatic check daily for updates. Fingers crossed I have yet to get a virus though your Dad has had several on his PC.

Re tech support - there are Apple Repair Centres who will sort things out for you, but I've always found it pretty easy to do myself as the system has never been as mind-boggling as the PC system folder. Norton Utilities has always solved all my technical problems and is probably the most essential piece of software you can get.

Compatibility isn't a problem these days either. I am constantly exchanging Word, Excel, Powerpoint and pdf files with the people I work with. I can't read .exe files but since viruses usually come in this form that doesn't worry me.

Hope that helps. I'm a bit of a Mac fan so I'm biased but I wouldn't swap for a PC for anyone.

Have you considered buying a refurbished Mac?

http://www.powermax.com/

As with anything, it's caveat emptor, but I have friends who've bought refurbished Macs and have had no problems with them.

Well, Alandriel, if you do buy one, make sure you check out the Mac Mini. They are just teh c00lest.

http://www.apple.com/macmini/

Used a Mac for 15 years; the only problems I've ever encountered were those of my own making and I've never, ever had a virus. Ever. Nor virus software .

Thing about a Mac Alandriel, is that once you have it, you plug it in, it works just as its supposed to and you don't need to do anything else or buy anything else or supplement it or tweak it. It just works.

I work in an office full of PCS; I can access the network, access data base, swap files, read files, all that network stuff that you need. No problem. They have problems opening my stuff sometimes, though.

But I love my Mac. Hugs screen

I can't even figure out how to download and play a video clip on a Mac.

Thanks Leoba and to you wonderful Mom With each passing day and with each glorious review of Mac's I'm edging closer and closer to taking the plunge.

Impenitent: You know, after having spent some 20 years with Windows, it's kind of hard to believe that life indeed can be simple. ... but I'm getting there

Alatar: you're so full of great info. Thanks It does look
Choices... choices....... *sigh...

LoR: hmmmm, refurbished is an idea, I'm just weary (yeah! I must get off it) of what would happen if.... If it comes with some kind of warranty/service and available in the UK... which means, I'll have to check out your link properly. Thanks

But now I have a serious tech problem... but for that I'll open a new thread.