board77

<is very afraid>

After reading the wise counsel of many who are working so hard on the constitution committee , I voted "no". I can be patient.

Here's my uninformed opinion. Please dismiss it for lack of competency.

I'm wondering how many of the people waiting to get into this board are like me. That is, I'm happy to accept whatever rule system b77ers want, really. I'm here because you guys are. I trust you all not to do anything outrageous, and so I feel that people who do have a strong preference for how the board is run should have their less diluted voices heard. If the others are like me, then will it really cause a problem with the constitution process to let them in? And here's why I think they are: because it's those who were the most affected by the TORC blowup who seem to be the most invested in creating a system in which that can't happen.. As far as I understand it, all of those people are already b77ers, and some were b77ers as far back as October.

My point is, even if some people do want to be very involved in structuring, I have to express skepticism that most will. Thus, I don't think allowing them in will throw the structuring process off significantly.

Since I was one of the last invitees in before the moratorium, let me give you my timeline:

c. March 1: read fandom_wank, found out about the TORC blowup, made it to board77.com, freaked out when I saw who had been banned, and immediately started sending out random emails to people asking for information. Spent the night reading TORC trying to figure out what happened. Sent email to b77 admins asking in, sent email to b77ers asking in.

TORC had about as much meaning over the following days as a graveyard would have to one looking to interact with the living. By which I mean, the living, and the explanations, and the uncensored speech were over at b77, something I couldn't see. Emails from my b77er friends contained talk of invites, ten day waiting periods, polls, constitutions, petitions...all these things that...c'mon, I was just a TORCer. It was a little bit above my head, I was grieving for the "board that was" in my own way (by which I mean, refreshing gmail constantly waiting for replies from TORCers) - and all I wanted to do was to get to this b77 place so it could substitute for the TORC that...mutated...when I wasn't even there to see it happen. It's a different kind of shock, sadness, nostalgia, whatever, than what the people who were there when it happened probably experienced, but it's still there nonetheless.

March 13 (I think): allowed in. Longest twelve days or so of my online life. (yes, there have been far more pressing things in RL )

If there are any others out there like me, my vote is to let them in. I don't know who they are, I'm not thinking of anyone specific, but if they want to be here with their friends, based on my own experience, I'd want to let them come.

Thanks for indulging my uneducated mini-ramble.

- TP

I'm curious to know whether this is a binding vote or an advisory poll. If it is a binding vote, is there a deadline for voting and a procedure for implementing this decision if the vote continues to be in favor of restarting the invite process?

I've always been confused about exactly what effect these periodic votes actually have.

No offense meant to anyone, particularly the wise and powerful admin that started this thread. I just think some clarification is in order.

I voted no.

If people get frustrated at not being able to welcome new people - GOOD! That will put a match under them to open the board.

EDIT:

Posted before I read; shouldn't be so hasty.

Tolkienpurist, I understand what you are saying. However, from where I stand, a closed board is anathema. I suspect that if everyone's are invited privately, the sense of urgency in opening the doors to all will dissipate.

I would prefer that sense of urgency to remain as a prod and a thorn.

Voronwe, this is advisory, because there is no structure in place for it to be anything else.

The promise was to "revisit the issue" on or about April 1. We simply wanted to know what the "sense of the board" was. If it had been overwhelmingly in favor of restarting invites--I can't speak for other admins, but we might possibly have considered taking an "unstructured" action, since as yet there is no structure. Closing to invites was done similarly.

However, there doesn't as yet seem to be any overwhelming majority for taking action, and under those circumstances, I would be inclined not to mess with things. Again, I don't speak for everybody, just me. But that's my thinking.

Impenitent's psot convinced me to vote no - maybe we should think in the constitution panel how to quicken the process.....

I voted yes because I am personally grateful to have been invited on to this board and to vote otherwise feels to me like pulling up the ladder. By all means manage the invites for ease and carry on with the preparations for opening the board.

I understand (and share, to a degree) the reasons for both reopening invites and for waiting until the Red Book is ready (did anyone say "fencesitting"?).

Yes, I dislike the Invite system, discussing people and their "worth" behind their backs.

Yes, I want the Constitution to be finished in peace, without hurry.

Yes, I want everybody to be able to have a gander around B77 and see what the big hoohah is about (not much, they'll realise).

So I'd suggest this: opening up Invites only to the people who express an interest in us, by registering straight away or emailing us.

Perhaps we should also let new people know very clearly about the Constitutional Convention going on, and how fluid the rules are right now... just a suggestion.

Berhael: that'd be a wonderful middle ground in my book.

I am going to propose that the Convention has enough of the Constitution in place to temporarily run this place.
My suggestion is this.
Let us take what we have now and put it to the membership for a vote.
That way we can govern ourselves at least enough to open this place up.
I really do not want to go the invite route again. That one issue has caused more problems around here than anything else. After the yes/no from the membership the Convention can continue their work.
The original how 160-170 members we have now will be the ones eligible to vote on the package.

P.S. Is it possible to have the RP characters username's location to state they are RP characters? Or somehow place them in their own category so a user can accurately count membership?

There is a list of RP IDs on top of the There and Back Forum.

I'm just too much of a lazy brat today to post you a link....

Thought I'd go and get the list for you while I displaced my activity.

Alternate ID's:
Arunakhôr -> Kaya
Bitsy Tattler -> LadyKat
Bréhon -> Kaya
boris_and_bruno -> crystal_seed
Hades -> Nin {formerly nienor niniel}
KalinelDineen -> Dindraug
Ragnor -> areanor
Randir -> LadyKat
Running With Scissors -> Estel
Synthia -> Guruthostirn
Tibodom Took -> Nin {formerly nienor niniel}
woman-of-secret-shadow -> Dindraug

*~Pips~*

Well subtracting the RP ID's, the admin ID, and people who have not posted or are not active, we have roughly 150 posters eligible to vote. We have had a grand total of 31 vote in here so far. Slightly more than 20%.
I hope that sort of apathy disappears when it comes time to vote for the convention.

Holby, when it's time to vote on the constitution, I think we should have a sticky with a link to the voting thread at the top of every forum.

The same for the boardwide discussion period, with links to the discussion threads.

Also, I think a lot of people see adopting a constitution as the last thing between us and opening.

All those things should motivate people.

I think the Business forum isn't as high-profile as it needs to be. Notifying people through sigs (as per Leoba) might be a good idea, or stickying votes. I don't think there's anybody that genuinely doesn't care about this place.

*~Pips~*

The business forum is about as 'high' profile as it can get... but people need to peek in - and participate. I'm certain that when the time comes for membership voting on the constitution we'll all yell at ya

Although I did vote NO on this advisory poll (or whatever you name it) I like Berhael's idea quite well actually ... so long as it could be a staggered process (to avoid any possible 'swamping' as we've had just recently). However, I'm aware that proceeding this way could also lead to problems. Whaf if poster X signs up and some here really would not feel comfortable at all? For me, it's hypothetical really. I don't have any major quibbles with anyone but am thinking about those that might have 'issues'.
On the other hand... what's so terrible in being patient and wait it out till the consitution stands and we're really ready?

How's that for fence-sitting ... though I must admit I still preferr the camp of 'no's' on this particular poll.

Holby wrote:

Is it possible to have the RP characters username's location to state they are RP characters? Or somehow place them in their own category so a user can accurately count membership?

Not a bad idea actually - to make the RP ID's a bit more transparent. Perhaps one of the current Admins could ammend the location accordingly for it would in no other way 'trespass' on the registered ID and only show on the memberlist.

And a PS for Pipps: this thread was only started two days ago. Easter holidays are still ongoing in some parts.... people need time to catch up and read. Patience

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Resident witch

Alandriel wrote:

On the other hand... what's so terrible in being patient and wait it out till the consitution stands and we're really ready?

We're going to lose people. The ones who are drifting away from TORC are going to drift away from the community altogether if we don't do something about it quickly.

*~Pips~*

Pips... sorry, but I don't think so. On the contrary actually. I think once we're open word will spread even more and we'll get lots of 'wow' - look what they've done. I think in the end it will all be to the positive but then, that's of course just my own opinion.

Take the other scenario. We open the door now, and are not really ready. Things are a bit all over the place. New posters enter a 'messy' place and that does not really reflect well now or does it nor does it make for a nice place to come and hang out.

I don't think we'll be 'loosing' anyone really, only perhaps the ones that would only nose about in here and hardly would participate. Sorry, but for those I don't feel a particular loss. Harsh? Perhaps so - it's only my 2 cents

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Resident witch

Pips, even if we don't reopen to invites now, it's clear from other advisory polls that there is overwhelming support for opening this board once the constitution is in place. And from what Jn and others have said, it might be possible to find a middle ground and vote on opening when we have "enough" of the constitution finished--enough that there are procedures in place to handle the kinds of problems that can arise on an open board.

I'd suggest getting in touch by email with people you're afraid will drift away. Do you have an email address in your sig on TORC? I did that in my last few months there, using a hotmail account I created with my TORC username so I wasn't sharing anything I didn't want to. And some people did get in touch with me that way and find out about B77.