board77

So, hal, are you saying that you think it was a good thing when the rangers temporarily quarantined someone engaging in behavior contrary to the members' rights (as outlined in the charter) in the Bike Racks?

Now, I got this from what you said here:

Quote:

The real hero here is TM, who did NOT react the way I and others initial reaction was... but instead just did her job, and ended things before they started.

Am I understanding you correctly? Because what TM did was temporarily confine democracy to the Bike Racks. Or did you mean something else?

Lali

yes, that's what I'm saying

I agree with Anthy.

As things stand right now, a request for a hearing has been made by two (or three, if you count TED) members, all of the Rangers have agreed that the circumstances warrant a hearing, so at this point a hearing is going to take place, assuming we can find enough people to be on the jury.

I personally do not think that this needs to be an angst ridden or drama filled process. It will only be that way if people make it so. Otherwise, it will be what it is, and when it's over that will be the end of it.

People are free to discuss the merits of this course of action ad nauseam if they so desire, but until a board wide decision is made to abandon the charter than we are still operating under the charter. No one is required to participate in any way if they do not wish to. For myself, I'm going to do what is required of me as a Ranger and nothing more.

Have a nice day.

Thanks for answering me, hal. I didn't want to read anything into what you had said, so thank you for clarifying.

tinwe, I agree.


Lali

TheEllipticalDisillusion wrote:

Quote:

So we're not allowed to express any opinions and try to persuade for what we think is best? Well...alright then.

Definitely not what holby was saying and you know that.

Thank you TED. Let's not start assuming things please.

hal wrote:

Well, I thought what Holby said to me about the priorities I have for my friends was worthy of a hearing... did I call for one? I'm perfectly within my rights to do so... but you know what? It wouldn't happen... and it shouldn't happen, because a hearing is not the first thing you do!

Well you would be wrong for wanting a hearing. He questioned you as a friend that's not against the rules.

hal wrote:

So where's teh problem? What's the solution? I can garuntee you a hearing is not it.

The problem is you don't think Hobly or Jewel have the right to call a hearing and again you're wrong they do whether or not you think it's the best solution.

[quote="Yov"Personally, I think what we really need to ban is the Business room.[/quote]

That's even better than a joke thread in the Bikeracks

Faramond wrote:

On another note, I wish you wouldn't say "fuck you" to people.

Me too it's rude and uncalled for.

Anthy wrote:

And also: whoever said it above is right. Holby and JS have a right to ask for the thing, under the charter, and procedures are being followed appropriately. They have the right to have their grievances addressed.

Thank you thank you thank you! This hits the nail on the head. All discussion about whether or not we should have a hearing loses because of this statement. Keep reading y'all my opinion will be at the end.

hal wrote:

The fact still remains, things were handled, at that point where TM did not react. If we had all just accepted that and moved on, there would not be any issues. if democracy did not leave, and persisted in being a proglem, there would be hearings and restrictions, and maybe the banning everyone seems to want to do. But he did leave, and there's no reason to do anything right now. It's not ignoring it, it's recognizing it's over.

But it's only partially over because people want a hearing. Just because someone backs down for a moment doesn't mean he or she wont' be back you of all people should know that. We can do nothing right now and wait for him to come back, but I think he should only have access to the Bikeracks until he does come back.

hal wrote:

As for my comments to Holby, well, ask him not to treat me like shit, and we'll have a place to start.

You need to grow up this is the most absurd thing you've said apart from thinking that I change my opinions after I talk to Holby. He's not a flippin' hypnotist I am capable of making my own decisions. YOU just have a chip on your shoulder and I think we all know why. And you have some balls strutting around here like you haven't said some mean shit to people. Holby hurt your ego boo flippin hoo.

MY OPINION ON THE WHOLE DEBACLE:

I've already said this but Eruname asked that for my thoughts. I personally wouldn't call a hearing because it's too much effort for someone I don't give a rats ass about. Had it been someone I knew then I might feel differently but this was my first (and hopefully last) encounter with democracy. He acted like a douche bag but we all have at times. I DO however, support Holby, Jewel, and TEDdy Baby if they want a hearing because I feel it is their right to request one. Yes, I received the PM but then democracy spread it around other threads for everyone to read therefore making it a board wide discussion. I disagree that just because the situation was handled by moving democracy to the Bikeracks that was the end of that. If everyone said "Okay he's gone let's move on" that would have been swell, but people decided that it wasn't okay and want to pursue further action so I stand by their decision. Who am I to say "No no no I don't care what that guy said who cares what you all want" that would be silly.

Can I request that this not be used as yet another opportunity to bash the charter and process round here? We've heard it all before. If you don't like the charter, either amend it or get the entire board to agree to scrap it. Until either of those things are done, we work with what we've got.

Democracy has decided to boycott us for a year. So what? He could change his mind tomorrow. I don't agree with allowing him to dictate the terms of his own absence. He broke the rules here, a hearing has been called, and after a jury has voted, his punishment will be decided and enforced by the members here. Not by some wishy washy "well he's gone so everythings peachy" statement of blind optimism. Need I point out that he's not the only person in the history of the board to make an "I'm never posting here again" statement?

I think we should take this as an opportunity to use the charter in a positive way for once. Who knows? Maybe its worth the effort.

Amazing.

A person spray paints a racial slur on a building. Anyone that presses charges is the trouble and drama maker.

Said person is booked and that is the end of it because he said he's boycotting the procedure because his pal was arrested somewhere for doing something somewhere else. And it is ok to trust the word of someone who stoops to that level. Case closed.

Pretty sure things don't work that way.

Was democracy remorseful over this? Did he apologize? See the errors of his ways?

No he did what he did without remorse, and is puportedly boycotting this place because hal was banned on HoF. He was temporarily locked in the bikeracks until a solution was determined. How is that a resolution?
It only appears resolved because he says he left. And we are to take the word of an individual who stoops to such a low level. We are going to leave it up to him to decide his fate.

Yeah there is drama over this, but the drama is caused by people dramatizing in this thread. It isn't the process that is causing the drama. It isn't me or even democracy that is causing it.

If people are unhappy with the way things are here, then change it. Stop whining about it. Otherwise too damn bad. This system took months and many votes by the people to put into place. This wasn't some fly by night decision by a few people. The mega overwhelming majority of the people here, current people here, voted in favor of it.

If there is such a huge outcry against these policies then act to change them. Stop whining about people utilizing the only societal system that is in place and stop trying to impose your sensibilities on others. It isn't up to anyone else to determine.
He crossed my line big time. He went beyond what I am willing to tolerate, and I am doing something about it. If you don't like that, too damn bad. You don't like the drama then stop whining and change the system.

If this thread didn't exist and the process was allowed to just work its course, this thing would be over with nary a word being uttered.
But no people feel the need to control and force their opinions on everyone else. Everyone except democracy is acting well within the charter.

If you don't want the charter, ditch it and I will be more than happy to handle this thing myself. We can have endless caniption fits and name calling. Such a hue and cry over someone acting fully within the laws set up by the people of this board. It leads me to believe that we should all just exact our own justice and operate within our own standards.

let me get this straight, did you just say democracy was "my pal?"

Congrats, Holby... if there was ever any chance of reconciling our differnces, you've just tossed them out the window... if people can't see your insane bias against me now, i don't know what could ever convince them.

frankly, I don't know if I could be more sickened by your entirely perjorative insinuations... I honestly don't know how to respond anymore.

That's not true.. I honestly wish I could be banned from any place you can post...

So, this thread is back to being about hal? Tiresome.

Take a deep breath, hal. You are seriously overreacting. Are you really trying to be banned?

Holby has every right to call for a hearing. I considered doing so myself.

My hero in all this is themary, who spoke up against the insult to her (no doormat, that's for sure!), yet was strong enough let it slide (thus not escalating the drama, for the sake of the community), and now is supportive of those who do want to make an issue of it (again, for the sake of the community). Her actions have been commendable.

Hear hear. May I say that all the rangers are handling this admirably.

(Though I personally feel that all the trouble started when we started taking this guy seriously.)

And I agree with Al that he shouldn't be allowed to dictate the terms of his own absence. Surely recent past experience has taught us that poeple often renege on promises of boycott.

Have a good relaxing time The Watcher. Don't fret that you are getting stick. Some people are not too keen on the Charter and when things like this crop up repeat their reservations but most seem to accept it and in any case we don't question our noble Rangers. For what it's worth I think you are doing the job excellently so don't feel too defensive.

If you are short of jurors I will be happy to take part.

I'd be happy to volunteer too.

By the way, while you're hiding in my sig pic, be sure to check out the nine-dollar pastries at the Chateau Lake Louise.

Can I add both of your names to the Jury Pool then?

Yup.

Thanks to all of you who are willing to be added to the jury pool!

$9 pastries indeed. And in Canadian money to boot!

The Watcher wrote:

And in Canadian money to boot!

Once upon a time, that would have been a bargain.

WampusCat wrote:

My hero in all this is themary, who spoke up against the insult to her (no doormat, that's for sure!), yet was strong enough let it slide (thus not escalating the drama, for the sake of the community), and now is supportive of those who do want to make an issue of it (again, for the sake of the community). Her actions have been commendable.

Hi.

I'm sorry, but I can't agree. TM, I feel that this comment of yours to democracy

Quote:

"I am better than you in every sense of the word now get on your knees and kiss my shoes"

may well have been the reason why the situation escalated in the first place.

I guess I could thank TM for not throwing a hissy fit after that or totally losing it in public, but that's actually something I expect from grown-ups I communicate with.

Hi Farawen.

Interesting. I didn't even recall that quote. At the time themary posted that, I assumed it was said with a joking tone so I didn't think of it as an outright insult but as a ranger trying to lighten up a direct order. Of course, democracy might have seen it very differently!

When I wrote that last post, I was thinking of what I saw as her rather restrained reaction to his PM, which came a bit later in the conversation.